The office of Jackson Council President Marshand Crisler bears the signs of a harsh duality. Crisler carries himself with a clean, pressed lookin startling contrast to the reporter sitting across from him. He's always clean and ironed, he's hardly ever been spotted with a stain on his shirt, and ring around the collar is something that happens to other people. There's a very good chance Crisler was up this morning before 5 a.m., and it's an even better bet that his clothes were ironed before he went to bed in the first place.
Nevertheless, his office is littered with stacks of paper in a manner that probably bugs him. The general fussiness of organic existence is just one of those little liabilities of working in a government office shared by other people.
Crisler's walls are covered with various awards and certificates commemorating past services and duties, both as a civilian and as a soldier. At only 37, the Marine, Army Reservist, and Air Force enlistee has been all over the planet, visiting dozens of places, sometimes in a cloud of smoke and mortar rounds. He's already one of the few Jacksonians who can boast of crossing the North Pole. His military career still imposes on his civilian life, snatching him away from his Ward 6 council seat in 2004, only to return him almost a year later in January that following yearjust in time to become one of the new mayor's loudest critics.
What drew you to the military?
I came up in a structured home. My parents are still married, married over 44 years. They're both educators, and they stressed education and college, and all of my kids graduated from Jackson State University, which I guess doesn't make my Dad, who attended Alcorn, and my Mom, who went to Valley, good recruiters for their respective universities.
But I decided I needed more structure in my life. I played collegiate football with Hinds Community College and majored in criminal justice. I decided I needed a break from that and went into the Marines to get more discipline. I picked a winner for discipline.
Why the Marines?
This was 1987. I went in originally going into brains over brawn, but found out I didn't have as much brains as I thought I did. I took the (military) test and came up five points shy of getting into the Air Force. They were like 'it's just five points. Take it again in six months, and you'll pass it,' but I got bitter and took it out on the Air Force, instead of blaming myself, and went into the Marines. In the Marines you sit in there about 15 minutes, and they make the Air Force look like a bunch of pansies. I bought into that with the recruiter and told him I wasn't interested in going into anything but the infantry.
So it's 1988, and you're sitting in the Marine Corps. How'd you like it?
In 1988, we had Noriega and Panama going on. I was part of the security that went down there and secured Noriega. I did about 4-1/2 years in infantry, then I transferred over into the military police right before I got out. I got out in 1992, and decided I needed to keep a little military in me and joined the Mississippi Army National Guard. A problem I had with the Marines was I had a son, my second child (Dominique, now 16) born with spinal bifida, and I had to go through an act of Congress to get off a ship and come home, but I loved my service. I am a Marine, but they take their differential service way too seriously. When I first got in the Marines, I was married. I had to get a waiver for my wife. You usually get waivers for drug arrests or traffic tickets, but I had to get a waiver for being married. My wife was a liability. If the Marines want you to have a wife, they'll issue you one.
I stayed in the Army Reserve about 13 years, reported for Operation Iraqi Freedom a couple of years ago, and now I've come full circle: I'm in the Air Force.
I was drawn to the military because I always had a passion to lead and be a part of the military in the sense that I believe in fighting for the constitutional rights of this country's citizens. I believe in the Constitution and don't think it needs to be tampered with. Once you start tampering with it, you start messing with all of it. It's a pandora's box.
You have a picture of you and (former Ward 5 Councilwoman) Betty-Dagner Cook posing with DNC Chairman Howard Dean. What makes you a Democrat?
I'm a moderate Democrat. But what makes me a Democrat is some of the more pressing issues that deal with the underprivileged and the disenfranchised, like health care, like government aid, federal aidto a limit. I don't think healthy people should receive federal aid for the rest of their lives. It's designed for recovery, until you get back on your feet. I am a fiscal conservative.
I think certain things should be done in moderation and nothing should be wide open. Some people say I straddle the fence, but I think, no, it's a matter of looking at the whole picture. We have to look at the fact that there is strength on both sides, and what you have to do is manage it.
The Republican Party believes in big business and elitism, and I don't buy into that. I think everybody ought to get their fair share and have equal playing fields. I know not everybody is going to succeed, but they ought to have the opportunity.
The population thins out at the top of the economic heap anyway. There's no point in cutting the legs out from under anybody. I just think the Republican Party philosophy is more ruthless.
I have a heart and a conscience and this puts me in the Democratic Party.
Yeah? Well, what's your view on abortion, Democrat? That's a big issue right now at the Mississippi Legislature.
I think there are real issues on both sides of the equation. I think a lot of moderate conservatives feel that way. You have to look at the total argument. I think after so many trimesters when the fetus has developed certain limbs and has reached a stage of mental development, it gets difficult for me to support abortion. But then you have an earlier stage where the embryo hasn't even fully formed yet. I'm not a scientist, but I don't think an egg can be classified as a human being. Then there's the morning-after pill, which I don't consider abortion. There are so many variables; I can't just give you a yes or no answer.
Let's talk about your job. How does this time around differ from your last term as a councilman?
I'm more aware of the duties involved in this job as a community representative. In your first term you're learning, and I've gotten some great lessons. I mean having the knowledge base. I think we've made some huge strides in developing community cohesion. Truth be known, I've always been one of those people who thinks civility and decorum are issues that we take to the forefront because I don't think you can handle any business without a calm, clear mind.
How is communication with this mayor, compared to the last?
There's a big difference. With this administration, unlike the last one, the mayor has not made a priority of communication with council members. The council has not been apprised of a lot of things going on, and it's frustrating, and it doesn't seem like its getting much better, though there have been episodes when the mayor has tried to come to the table. He's made some cameo visits to the office, but it has to be more defined, organized and disciplined. It needs to be something that occurs weekly.
We're dealing with episodes of Mayor (Melton) going out and making grand statements without first sitting down with policy-makers to talk about how we can do this in a legal manner or appropriate manner. We've done good not to have more lawsuits than we've had. The legal sharks have been quite kind to this administration, but I fear that's going to wear out soon.
An attorney for employees from the recently shut-down Crime Prevention Unit is still looking for the city to provide information for a civil service hearing regarding that matter.
If there's an official complaint leveled against the city, and the city is not being cooperative, then the council can certainly address the issue, but right now the legal representative is dealing strictly with the mayor's office. If they feel they're going to take stronger actions then they need to address the council as a whole. If citizens don't feel like things are happening the way it should on one side of the government, then go to the other side. That's the council.
Where do you stand on the ComStat (crime) numbers? Many citizens would like to see them published.
I've had sparse reports sent to my office. It's not coming in as fast as I'd like it to, but I'm getting them. I haven't been particular about getting them published in the newspapers. My concern was that as a representative of my ward, I have these statistics available so I can make sure I can get that information to the leaders in those communities so that they can target crime in those areas.
Right now, though, criminals are getting comfortable because nobody can target those areas they're working in because the general public doesn't have the numbers to tell them. Crime is nomadic, and if you wait for bi-annual reports, nine times out of 10, those reports are no longer worth the paper they're written on. But if you get them in a reasonable amount of time, like two weeks out at the most, you can target that crime more easily.
How do you feel about the city releasing the ComStat figures through the city and not the press?
I think it just needs to be available to the public, whether you put it on the Web site or through Public Access (television). I just want to make sure the public has access to it.
Have you considered running for mayor?
(Laughter.) It's much too early to think about that. Right now I have a lot of work cut out for me just keeping the council and South Jackson going in the right direction.
Many of Melton's friends say you're trying to be mayor already. What's your response?
I stand against the mayor sometimes because of his policy issues. Our No. 1 responsibility as policy-makers is to make sure these decisions support what the citizens of Jackson want. Many of his policies carry legal implications, so I'm cautious when it comes to that. If I feel there's going to be a legal problem, I'm going to raise the question.
But criticizing the mayor goes with the job of being president. I've only gotten those types of comments when I was president. I've been president three of my five years. It's amazing that back when I'm a regular ward representative, I don't hear that.
If you take a stand against the mayor on issues, you're always going to be painted in that light. What I'm attempting to do is be the best council member I can be.
Tell me your plan for promoting business in Jackson.
I'm leading the charge in my Buy Jackson campaign, where we're looking to pull our monetary resources back into Jackson. It'll require a lot of effort. I had a business owner ask me recently 'how long do you think it'll take for this campaign to have an impact?' and I said 'honestly? 45 days,' and they looked at me with a puzzled look as if I had no clue how things work and they were bold enough to say 'I like you, Marshand, but that's not realistic.'
Well, I think it is realistic. I think if I can get 184,000 people to buy into the Buy Jackson campaign, and we stop spending money outside the city.
Hey, that's a damn boycott!
No, that's not a boycottit's pro-Jackson. It's saying I'm going to spend my money right here in the city of Jackson to make sure that it grows and we can re-habilitate it, because, guess what, if we did do a real boycott you wouldn't have Pearl, you wouldn't have Madison or Flowood or Brandon or any of these other communities. I don't think you can hang a boycott around out necks. We built those communities. They should say 'thank you.' That's what they should be saying. If anybody wants to make that negative, they can go right ahead, but it's all about being positive.
I don't think the media has done a good enough job of explaining how important it is to have a healthy capital city. We don't talk about the positive. We only talk about the negative. That only accelerates the demise of a city.
Take this Buy Jackson campaign. I can assure you it'll get more negative reports than positive reports. That's the way they discredit it, so nobody buys into it. But we're staying positive, because the bottom line is we want those people outside this community to invest in us too. I mean, if you're working hereyou basically reside here, right?
You see the commute lines every morning and evening. What ever happened to the toll-booth idea?
Canned. Flushed. Trashed. It required legislative action, and it got no traction. Every year we bring it up, and it doesn't even get past a committee, but that's not the only option. You could do a user fee. A road tax. An occupational taxmeaning if you work in Jackson, you should pay an amount of money there. It comes straight out of your paycheck.
The first thing business owners will say is you're hurting business with a new tax.
So? Where are they going to go?
Madison? Pearl maybe?
My point is, how many jobs are in Pearl? Better yet, how many industries are in Madison? You can't pick up and move the capitol city. It's not going anywhere. We're not talking about Greenville. States don't change capitols. The industry here is government. As long as that's the case it will contain the type of jobs that can support those $2 million homes in Madison.
Yeah, but that kind of tax also requires legislative approval, right?
Yeah, but if you put enough emphasis on what the real issues are, you'll get results. Our state leaders have not made our city a priority for 25 years, but now there's a sense of desperation. Thirty-eight percent of property in the city of Jackson is non-taxable, with no type of alternative funding from the state to offset that.
Hold legislators accountable for not supporting the capital city. They're killing the state. If you kill the capital, you kill the state. So goes the capital, so goes Mississippi. Mississippi falters because the state capital falters. Look at any successful state, and you've got yourself a beautiful capitol city.
You've made the criticism before that the mayor seems to have low regard for certain laws. Do you believe that?
Yes, you have to say that. As a law enforcement officerlove me hate me, but I am what I amI believe in enforcing the law, but I believe in enforcing it in the right context. Right now as a City Council member I'm not acting as a law enforcement officer, I'm acting as a policy maker, so I'm not out there enforcing it anymore because that may be unethical. That's why I'm a crime prevention specialist right now with the Hinds County Sheriffs Department. There's no arresting going on. Because I respect the difference between those branches of government, I decided to work with the sheriff to get in a job specialty that does not contradict my office as a city council member.
Right now the mayor is in the executive branch of government. That doesn't have anything to do with enforcement. It has everything to do with implementation. Enforcement and laws fall into the judicial branch of government, so if you're out there kicking in doors, making arrests, you're actually operating in the judicial branch. He could argue that point, saying the police department is under his branch, and he's right, but they operate as a judicial office and they're enforcing the law. You may have the police under your tier, but they're a judicial office.
What do you think of the police department gobbling up the municipal court as Melton suggested last week? He said corruption demanded it.
That decision of his will take the support of the council to do that, and I won't support it because it contradicts the fair and impartial judicial system. I mean, how can it be fair and impartial if it's under the police department? Putting the judges under the chief doesn't make sense.
Is the vote coming up?
I don't know. I don't think Melton would get the majority of the council's support on that, but I don't know. I just don't think that's conducive to what this system was set up for, and it speaks badly. It doesn't sound legal, but that's never stopped Melton before. I got an opinion going out now to the A.G.'s office, so we'll see.
How'd you take it when you heard about it?
Melton can't shock me anymore. He's at that point now with me. When I heard it, I thought that this is just another one of those things he does without research, and that's unfortunate, because research is supposed to be a big part of his job. The system isn't really complicated. There are essentially four parts to the process, and that is creation, that is the development of a plan, then you have the review and approval of the plan, and then you have implementation. The middle portion falls into the council. The other two fall into the mayor's right. What's odd about this whole situation is the two that's missing are development and implementation, so we don't have a plan to even review or approve. We're sitting here stagnant.
We're wondering when we're going to get a plan, and that's where we're most at odds. Melton will tell you 'I got a plan.' Well, produce that thing. It's been a whole year. Bring it on.
What do you think about Melton's approval rating? Some 42 percent of Jacksonians rated his job as "excellent," according to our recent poll with WAPT.
I think the poll is skewed. A lot of people don't participate in polling. I know doggone well, if you talk to the educated up in Ward 2 and Ward 6, it would be a totally different poll. I know Ward 6 approval is falling fast. Seven is probably about the same. A lot of it has to do with perception. Perception killed the last mayor. It's helping this one, and the more the media says negative things about him, the stronger he getskind of like (Councilman Kenneth) Stokes.
I told somebody recently that the more I say, the more they love him and the more they hate me. I'm just amazed.
They don't even have any information to go by. The crime rate has not gone down. Talk to Northeast Jackson and ask them if crime's gone down. They're breaking into cars left and right up there. Every time you turn around somebody's getting shot, stabbed or killed, just like in Harvey's administration.
We could take a ride around the city. There is an illegal pharmaceutical company on every corner. It's ridiculous.
You really believe that?
I'm serious. As popular as my face is I guarantee you I could go out and buy dope right now. I remember when I was a narcotics officer, me and my coworkers were in a car that still had the sheriff department's print on it. Still said "sheriff" on the sides where the paint was peeling off, and I said "these folks out here are so wide open I bet you we could buy dope in this car."
A buddy of mine bet a fifth of Crown Royal. My friend said "there ain't no way in the world. Marshand, we even got radios in the car."
We were behind Jackson State. Thank God our efforts got most of that bulldozed and we now have the Metro Parkway, but I said "take a left up this street here," and when we did there's a guy on the porch saying "heeeyy."
I'm sitting there trying to hide the shotgun with my leg. The man ran up to the car, and said, "What'cha need?" I said "I need three sacks." And he was just getting ready to take the money when there was a lady knocking on the window on the other side of the car. I'm paying money to this fool and then knock knock knock, she's already got bags in her hand.
We jump out of the car and grab both of them. We were like "what in the world." My buddy was so mad he didn't know what to do. But that's what it's like right now. The dealers are so wide open. Sure Melton might get pissed, if I say it, but I'm just being honest. My background is in narcotics. If I don't know anything else, I know narcotics, and I'm saying they're wide open out there in the streets.
But people have their own perception. It's gotten to the point in Jackson where if you talk enough people will believe you. Action means nothing anymore. You can say what you want, but if you're not going to do a follow-up or find out if they're telling the truth, they can tell you anything.
What do you think of Marcus Ward's light rail idea?
Light rail captures the tri-county area, perhaps Warren County and Rankin County to go with it. It could work, but everybody has to sign on to it. It'll cost a lot of money, but it could be done if the right person drafts the right proposal.
It would certainly help the city funds, but it would have to be built. A lot of major metropolitan cities do that by forming partnerships with their adjacent counties. It could work, but there needs to be a good solid plan.
What happened with the battle last year regarding the council president position?
There's a difference of opinion on that. You have to come up with four votes, and the majority rules, so what you have to understand is when I left for Iraq, it was under the auspice of "let's do what's best for the council." I could've easily gone to Iraq as council president, and been acting president until I got back. So me and Dr. McLemore sat down and discussed the best way to do it, so I decided to resign and give them solid leadership while I was gone. Bad enough me being gone, but worse not having stable leadership.
Of course you knew the situation between me and Mr. Brown. (Former Ward 6 Councilman Bo Brown was vice president at the time and felt he should have ascended to the presidency upon Crisler's departure.) We had a gentlemen's agreement that when I got back the right thing to do, because I was giving up half my term as president, that when I got back I would be considered council president.
Well, when I got back, there was a change of mind. McLemore disagreed on how we should broach this. I feel bruised because I did my part. Not only did I serve my country, but we had an agreement, and when I came back he'd reneged on that agreement. Obviously it stung a bit. It wasn't as personal as people would like to believe. It really had more to do with the transition of the office. I felt like I could be a better balance.
The rumor is that Councilman Stokes can work with you, but he couldn't work with McLemore.
You're all over it. And so you have to take all that under consideration. I knew Frank Melton would come in with a different leadership style and would probably be more antagonistic to Dr. McLemore, and I didn't think it would be a good thing to be very volatile in the new mayor's first term. Yeah, I know it's been volatile at times under me, but it could have been even more volatile. I love McLemore to death, but he's got a different leadership style.
Is McLemore planning to run for the presidency soon?
McLemore hasn't said he's planning to run again when it's time in three or four months, but he may. I've never had a problem with his leadership. It's just different from mine. I just think we need to be as flexible as we can be. We need to see both sides of the equation.
Melton knew what he was getting into if McLemore was president, right?
Of course he did.
So he probably preferred you over McLemore, right?
I think he did in the interim. That may have changed now. I don't know if he's thinking he would prefer McLemore, but he knows now that he didn't get what he was bargaining for in me either. But I'm not going to let the president of the council's office be controlled by any outside entity. My job is to make sure the council runs efficiently.
Did Melton influence Councilman Frank Bluntson to vote in favor of you? Is that how you got the majority vote?
That's pretty much it, because I didn't really need McLemore's vote. He needed my vote. My vote was the swing vote in that one, and it still is, I think. The system's made with an odd number, so there'll be a swing vote.
This is interesting because it now appears that we have a new working majority, and I think I'll share that with you now.
(Crisler opens a zip folder laying on the table between us and presents a docket sheet showing four names in favor of restructuring the city clerk's department. On the list are the names of Ward 5's Frank Bluntson, Ward 6's Charles Tillman and Ward 3's Kenneth Stokesall faithful yes-men to Melton's decisionsand Ward 1 Councilman Ben Allen.)
What's this mean? So they came to an agreement on office staffing. What's the significance of this?
We as a city council are charged with making sure that we have a productive, efficient office, and we do that through our city clerks, who are our day-to-day operators of the city council. Having said that, you'd think the working majority would be on the same page as to how we do that. This is just one of many decisions. Of course, there was the issue not too long ago of the petty cash fund. It was the same four people. Notice three others were missing on that vote.
Can you really count Allen as a faithful member of the new majority?
He may gripe sometimes, but when it comes to something significant, he's right over there with them. He's on the fence, but too often he jumps to the other side.
What bugs you about budget figures?
I'm afraid of what we'll find when its time for the budget to be revised.
Why?
Last time we did a budget revision, Harvey (Johnson) pretty much had his balanced. It largely went according to his script. And his numbers were accurate. Of course we had a great financial adviser at the time, the Malachi Group, which was doing a heck of a job. Our bond rating was great, but this one this year is going to take some time.
You think there will be problems?
(Crisler gives a very impatient look.) Now what do you think? It'll all come out when the books are open. There's nothing to say yet, but I promise you, you will be sick of writing about this budget after a while because it's going to make the papers over and over again.
Why are you worried? If it is a mess, this will all be on the mayor, won't it?
I hear that all the time. They always say 'ease up on your opposition to what the mayor's doing. The situation will take care of itself. You'll be the next mayor, soon. Let him dig his hole, let the links of the chain run out,' but that's irresponsible. The people out there that are essentially saying to me, as an elected official, that they want me to be irresponsible. They're really saying 'you're in a position to affect change and to try to help the city in a sense that we don't want to get ourselves in too much legal trouble and get so many lawsuits and the money's not being spent in the most fiscally responsible manner. But don't say nothing about that right now. Just let it all play out, so basically let the city fall to the ground and then put the blame on the mayor's shoulder.'
The reason I fight so hard to do the best job we can do is because I know I have responsibilities and that I can be held accountable. I want to be held accountable. What I don't want to do is sit back and say I'm not doing anything because it makes me appear like I'm stepping outside my role as a legislator and trying to be the mayor. That's flawed thinking. My part is to see that the weight is balanced, and we do that by asking questions, looking into things and doing research.
Why a person would criticize somebody for doing that escapes me but its not going to sway my decision because I know I'm doing what state law requires me to do.
If Frank jumps off a cliff voters are going to say 'you were sitting there watching that happen. Why didn't you do anything to stop it?'
These will be the same people who told me to back-off the guy. If you're going to chastise me, do it for the right reasons, not the wrong ones. And the wrong thing to do, in my estimation, is to sit back and watch things crumble. That's not leadership. Council members are city leaders. Leadership is being proactive, not reactive. The military taught me that, and I'm glad they did, because it's a fine lesson in life and a lot of people run from that.
The budget cuts we had recently. Does that ever happen outside budget time?
It comes during the budget process. You generally don't come behind it as a revision and do a cut. You're supposed to have everything in the budget when you get it adopted.
Yeah, but have you ever seen a budget cut or tax hike outside budget time?
I have not. Not since I've been on council. Maybe there have been some exceptions, but not during my time on council. You see, part of budget time involves forecasting what's coming down the road, and you have to be responsible in doing that, so you go ahead and put in a tax increase, mill increase or staffing cuts in the beginning, so it can capture all that as you go out. You don't get down the road and say, "Dang, I miscalculated. Let's cut some more." I don't think voters realize that you're not supposed to do that, but I do.
Melton said last year that there wasn't going to be any fee increases. Now he's talking about raising the sanitation fee by $3. That should've been captured in the budget. All this stuff is reactionary, see?
If you're proactive, you should've already seen the need for a fee hike or a budget cut. I'm sure his finance team had seen it. That's why they asked him to push for a mill increase at the beginning of the budget, but Melton came back and said "I don't want that. It's not popular."
I bet (Chief Financial Officer) Peyton Prospere's eyes bugged when that happened.
Yeah, and I bet they've been bugging ever since.
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