Jackson Free Press

These may be strange days for a Capitol City, but Jackson's rebirth continues to pick up speed, despite the antics of its indicted mayor.

Council President Ben Allen used Monday's council session to discuss positive developments that the media ignore.

"We had a meeting … and we talked about all these good things coming to the city," Allen said. "We might have a stadium opening up right down the street from city hall, and we got all these new opportunities opening up … and the next day, The Clarion-Ledger headline is 'City to Tap Budget Reserves' or something like that. And I had to ask, 'Just what meeting were you attending?'"

Indeed, new businesses are on the way, even as the city's mayor fights to retain credibility in the wake of felony indictments.

Explosion in Downtown Living

Attorney David Watkins, after years of battling setback after setback, is now mulling over bids for contractors looking to begin the work on the King Edward Hotel. Bids will be awarded in October, with actual construction expected to begin in early 2007. Watkins and New Orleans Saints running back Deuce McAllister, along with HRI Inc. of New Orleans, will spend $55 million refurbishing the century-old anti-landmark.

For 40 years, the building has served as a testament to a city abandoned and left to decay by its middle-class residents fleeing to new neighborhoods outside the city.

Watkins, however, heralds the national trend of young professionals moving back into city cores in search of streetlights and nightlife. They will find what they want in downtown Jackson, he vows. The King Edward will become a mixed-use facility with 172 hotel rooms, 50 apartments and condominiums, as well as shops and office space—oh, and a sushi bar. Watkins says it has to have a sushi bar.

"People are moving inwards toward the city," Watkins said. "Look, you can't re-create a downtown like Jackson in a suburban community. It's decades old, it's got history. You can't pick that up and move that somewhere else."

HRI and Watkins are also looking to implement a multi-use plan for the Standard Life Building, which is also downtown. Currently, the building houses the Jackson Police Department, but planners at last week's council meeting explained that the new police headquarters are coming along nicely and should be ready for use within months.

"I can't say, with all these hold-ups, that the King Edward is going to bring the profits now that we'd originally envisioned, but maybe we can recoup some of that through the Standard Life Building," Watkins said. "We'd like to do something with that space, perhaps add some parking, maybe bring in some more condominiums."

Watkins also is rubbing his hands together at the possibility of the state putting the Robert E. Lee Building up for sale, and thinks that a number of developers could be "chomping at the bit" convert it into residential units, possibly upscale condominiums. Watkins' development partners, HRI Inc., is the kind of business that has taken the bait at such prospects in the past, and other developers that cater to building residences with a little history in them could see value in the building. At the moment, though, developers have no means to invest until the state actually puts the "for sale" sign on the sidewalk in front of the Robert E. Lee.

Katrina's Silver Lining

In the meantime, more living space will soon open up nearby at the Old Ironworks Building on Gallatin Street. The building already offers loft living, but more is on the way. Pat Pigott, who owns the Ironworks studio, said he plans to add another 14 apartments to the three already in the building, bringing occupancy up to 17.

"I plan to have everything from a one-bedroom flat to a three-bedroom townhouse, ranging in price from about $800 to $2,300 a month," Pigott said. "Then, depending on how this goes, I also have the Barefield office building across the street. We will have decided on whether to develop that in a year."

Further down the street, developers are set to make land currently owned by Entergy and the state explode.

"Well, we got (bid) proposals for the development of Phase 1 of the Capitol Green Project," says John Lawrence, president of Downtown Partners, an organization formed to promote growth and re-investment in the downtown area. "We've got the bid proposals in hand, we've been reviewing them. We're keeping quiet because we don't want people tainting the review committee. … We should have interviews with prospective developers in a couple of weeks."

Entergy Economic Development Director John Turner told the Jackson Free Press this week that Entergy is already eyeing New York developer Full Spectrum, which is promising hotels, housing and a movie theater for the project. The project will ultimately result in nearly a million square feet of retail, hotel, office and public space, as well as residential space, says Lawrence. Before the onset of Katrina, however, it wasn't looking likely.

Entergy owns a large swath of land along Jefferson Street, where it sits upon a natural bluff overlooking the floodplain of the Pearl River. Haley Fisackerly, vice president of customer operations for Entergy Mississippi, announced last year that after months of planning, the idea of developing the largely unused portion of Jefferson Street was finally kicking forward. Fisackerly and Entergy recently joined with Ted Duckworth and his associates to make the new Electric Building a reality. (Entergy had been contemplating abandoning that building before developers came forward to change it into new apartment and business space).

Strung out by high costs and unwilling investors, the Old Capitol Green project lingered in limbo for years before getting a feverish boost from tax incentives via federal GO Zone legislation, designed to counter the 2005 damage of Hurricane Katrina. Suddenly, investors are falling over themselves trying to get at what will likely prove to be a very high return for their investment.

The Old Capitol Green project is spurring other joint developments. Attorney Crymes Pittman Jr. plans to have a hand in housing development along Jefferson Street, telling developers that he would like to convert an old warehouse and neighboring structures into loft-style apartments and scenic green space.

Tanya Scott-Graves, the 37-year-old managing partner of Ceva Green, is ready to plunk down $40 million for a "Miami-style lifestyle center" on State Street, in the abandoned Cadillac dealership.

"It looks like eight to 10 stories, with about 55 residential units in it," says Scott-Graves. "It'll contain three floors of commercial and retail, a five-star restaurant, private executive lounge, spa, salon, gym. We're keeping financial backing close to the mouth, but so far everything looks absolutely fabulous. We're very confident. We've gotten the nod from several people outside the state interested in investing. For us, the major thing right now is to secure the property and move forward with the financing of the project."

Ceva Green Development, an offshoot of Ceva Corp. specializes in environmentally friendly real estate development: commercial, residential and retail. Scott-Graves says the project is tied in with the Capitol Green Project, though not fully dependent on it, pointing out that she's already pre-leasing for the residential units and the commercial space. A Web site dedicated to pre-leasing will be up and running within the next three weeks, she says.

Scott-Graves says the multi-use building will include sustainable living construction material and furnishings as well as solar panels and architectural amenities designed to keep living costs to a minimum.

She says Ceva will open a temporary office downtown prior to construction of the Old Capitol Green project, probably in the Electric 308 building. "It's a green office, of course," she says. "Come see the sustainable furniture and walls."

The Brandon resident is married to Chris Graves, son of Judge James Graves—but is not about to live in the shadow of her in-laws. Her own father, Corbett Scott Sr., is the big money behind the Ceva project, she says. Corbett Scott was stuck in Jackson when Hurricane Katrina struck, and his new familiarity with the city may have spurred his willingness to invest.

"I'm very proud of my pop for being willing to invest in a state with no ties prior to my husband," Scott-Graves says.

Other development plans aren't moving as fast. In July, the law firm Butler, Snow, O'Mara, Stevens & Cannada announced that they're moving to the former cow pastures of Ridgeland in 2009, taking hundreds of jobs out of downtown. The move put on hold the development of Two Jackson Place, which Parkway Properties had been putting together, with Butler, Snow as the anchor business.

Steve Rogers, of Parkway Properties, says he'd like the project to go forward without them. Parkway already owns One Jackson Place, City Center, and 111 East Capitol—all of which are almost fully occupied or used.

"It's too early for me to make any kind of comment about progress, yet, because there's a lot of movement in the city of professional firms. (Parkway) is certainly ready to do its part to invest in downtown Jackson," Rogers says. "I'd very much like to see the redevelopment of this entire block finished up as we'd originally planned 20 years ago, and I think with all the professional firms moving today there's a very high chance that we could do this but we need some things to fall into place. We're hopeful."

Farish Street—Finally?

Other projects may finally be moving forward after some serious delays.

Heavy red tape stalled development of the Farish Street Entertainment District for many months. Last year, Performa Real Estate, which gave Memphis' Beale Street new life, found more asbestos in some buildings that city inspectors missed. And then came the financing issues. Mississippi Development Authority agreed to toss in about $5 million in state funding for the project if Performa agreed to first commit to the renovation of housing units in the district.

Construction for the units must fit historic dimensions, however, and the Farish Street Historic District Neighborhood Foundation had issues with the design Performa offered. Performa Real Estate CEO John Elkington said Performa is working out a loan with a state lender that would provide money for the project. He promised more details in the next few days.

Elkington added, however, that issues other than money haunted the project for weeks.

"You can say that local government instability was slowing the process," Elkington said. "We had a great relationship with Harvey Johnson. Everything was fine and moving along, but when the new administration came in, the rules kept changing on us."

Elkington said he had a problem with city employees, which Performa was accustomed to working with, vanishing from their jobs during the last 12 months.

"(Mayor Frank Melton) fires the head of the building department, he fires the head of planning, and we decided that we needed to pause and take a breath," Elkington said. "I mean, Jimmy Heidel is a great guy, but Jimmy Heidel is only a consultant, and he could've been gone next week. In some ways, we were afraid to act."

Other projects possibly on the way include two new restaurants around the City Hall area, and the Convention Center Hotel, which is riding the tails of the emerging convention center. Ted Duckworth—supposedly the mind behind the restaurants—could not be reached for comment. Jimmy Heidel, the driving force behind the Convention Center Hotel, was also out of town this week, though Rogers at Parkway Properties says his company is on record as supporting parking for the hotel if it becomes a reality.

"Hopefully, the JRA and the city can get together and offer some solutions there," Rogers said.

West Jackson Shining

Of course, not all the development is coming to downtown.

Jackson State University has two possible projects under consideration. Rumor has it that the university is looking for its own stadium, though JSU Vice President of Finance Troy Stovall was unable to comment on that or the university's efforts at urban renewal around the Metro Parkway. The university has been buying land up and down the parkway and could be gearing up for some of its own urban renewal, possibly to the tune of 200 or 300 homes.

West Jackson is already seeing the first, delicate tendrils of redevelopment, though.

Greg and Kathy McDade have been a growing presence in the city, owning and managing grocery stores in locations in Woodland Hills Shopping Center, Maywood Mart and on Fortification Street. Now they've set up shop at the old Jitney Jungle store in Westland Plaza.

Westland Plaza was already undergoing a re-emergence of its own, with new storefront grants making possible fresh lighting, new sidewalk space and a new Walgreens drug store. Now Westland has the benefit of a McDade's Food Store, and Kathy McDade says the community has welcomed them.

"We had a grand opening a week ago today. Everything's great. The neighborhood has received us well. They seem to be excited that there's a grocery store back in their neighborhood," McDade said. "They've just reached out to us and made us a part of their families."

McDade says concerns about the rising cost of merchandise due to theft (shrinkage) are overstated.

"Shrink is always a problem, no matter what kind of store you are or what you sell, but we do
everything we can to have a clean, safe place for my customers and employees. We have security in our stores—security cameras. We did everything we could to create that safe environment, and we're not experiencing any noticeable problems at all."

JPD Precinct 2 has a work station in the Westland store; officers visit the location to fill out paperwork or file information. McDade says there's always a police car in the parking lot.

"So far, we're doing great business," she says, adding that keeping the shelves stocked with a wide variety of products likely has much to do with that.

West Capitol Street has seen a slight resurgence in retail activity, with a price-conscious Family Dollar Store opening up just down the street from the revamped Jackson Zoological Park. David Watkins says he would like to be able to help coax a new Wal-Mart to the spot. Jackson currently only has one mega-store branch, off Highway 18, with at least four other branches around the city's borders, positioned close to city residents.

Watkins says the mega-chain has been implementing a successful new policy of aiming branches at low-income neighborhoods.

Wal-Mart announced a new initiative this spring to open 10 new Wal-Marts a year for the next five years in several urban centers that may not fit their traditional strategic growth pattern, for the purpose of urban development in lower income areas.

"Deuce and HRI and I are working on a Wal-Mart in Jackson, to try to do a little urban blight removal. We'll stick it wherever it will do the most good, either West Capitol Street, or Robinson Road, or somewhere close to Jackson State. I'd like it on West Capitol myself," Watkins said.

Wal-Mart attempted a similar experiment in New Orleans last year in a low-rent area. Down went some houses, up went the Wal-Mart, and Watkins says it's been a good anchor for other retail in that spot.

"Wal-Mart is the most cost-sensitive retailer around, and marketing tells you that if you find an area with a massive amount of people you'll get business—and we've got 45 to 50 thousand in West Jackson who are not being served by a Wal-Mart. People from Jackson have to drive. Why not put one on Capitol Street, a very short distance from Fondren, Jackson State and Belhaven and clean up West Jackson and provide an economic incentive? People going to those places need to stop and get gas. Generally, when you build a Wal-Mart, it will attract other tenants," Watkins said.

'Not One-Trick Ponies'

More development goodness could be opening up along the northern sector of I-55, following the lead of the Deuce McAllister dealership. Ward 2 Councilman Leslie McLemore said he was delighted at the possibility of a CarMax dealership filling the considerable parking space left vacant by the exit of K-Mart at the corner of Beasley Road and I-55 frontage Road.

"I went to the site-plan review committee meeting several weeks ago when (CarMax) came in and started the paperwork to locate their facility at the old K-Mart building," McLemore said. "Anything to shore up the tax base is always helpful."

Trina H. Lee, public relations manager at CarMax, confirmed that the company was in the preliminary stages of bringing a branch to the area.

"We're a growing company, and we're always interested in new markets," Lee said. "We have one store in Birmingham and one store in Texas—in your neighboring areas—so we would definitely be excited about (Mississippi)."

Lee describes the business as a new kind of car dealership. "We're a no-haggle, no-hassle used-car retailer. When you come to the store, there's one price on the vehicle and that's the price you pay. It's sort of like going to Lowe's. You walk in and all the prices are clearly marked. Select the one that's best for you and suits your needs."

Business in Fondren has been brisk of late, with developer Mike Peters' Duling Street project having great success in snagging vendors, according to Peters.

"We're finalizing plans with several big tenants that hopefully should come to some kind of head in the next 30 or 45 days. We're still hoping to break ground Nov. 1, but I know we'll break down before the end of the year," Peters said, asking for another 30 days before he officially releases the names of any tenants.

Peters is remodeling the building formerly known as Duling School and adding two new adjoining projects, one on the corner of Duling Avenue and State Street, the other cornering Duling and Old Canton Road. Peters said the project will be similar to the Fondren Corner mixed-use facility. Besides businesses, Duling will sport condominiums running $200,000 or more, Peters says.

In addition to this, Fondren is about to get its own tailor-made pizzeria, courtesy of Jeff Good, one of the masterminds behind Bravo!.

"We've been working four-and-a-half months on a sauce and five-and -a-half months on a pizza dough, and we're there. We're not one-trick ponies. This is completely different from Broad Street, completely different from Bravo!. We're bringing in some very classic brick ovens out of New Jersey, and those are going to be the centerpiece for cooking the pizzas," Good said.

Good said he expects the restaurant, Sal & Mookie's, to be open by January. By February, many Fondren residents will have likely gained another 10 pounds, because the restaurant will also serve high-end ice creams and desserts.

The new Fondren development will receive a little help in getting people to the area; the City Council voted recently to approve the license application for a new public transportation system. The Fondren Express is basically a remodeled Steel Magnolia trolley, which will run a circuit between local hospitals and the businesses and restaurants of the Fondren area.

Alan French, of Fondren's Real Estate Solutions, said he devised the trolley idea to combat a growing parking problem in the Fondren community.

"People come here from the hospital and other places to get away from things, to shop, eat, but they may not want to walk the distance they have to travel to get here. We want to make that easier for them," French said.

Regardless of the new development slated for the area, the mayor's office has most likely had a detrimental affect on drawing dozens of other prospective businesses to Jackson.

Belhaven economics professor William Penn said the mayor's antics may have turned off many businesses considering moving to Jackson. He added, however, that a greater influence now would be how the city government responded to the scandal.

"What is more pertinent to business attraction now is whether or not things seem to be in control or out of control. Are they being rectified or is there gridlock? We have a situation where the executive breaks ties with the legislative," Penn asked. "What happens now is very important."

Penn also said he worried that negative press sure to come from any criminal trial of the mayor would be a factor.

"The indictment, unfortunately, carries on regardless of whether or not he resigns. If he is convicted, he'll have to resign by law. What I hope is that this thing will be adjudicated. He can't plead no contest because then he'd have to resign, so the problem is while this thing drags on, what's going to be the response of City Council to the mayor and vice versa?"

Previous Comments

ID

80469

Comment

Adam, great article surveying the development downtown and in other areas. There is definitely a lot going on. Great to see an in-depth article on it.

Author

MAllen

Date

2006-09-20T22:49:55-06:00

ID

80470

Comment

This will prove the naysayers who think Jackson has nothing going for it wrong. Hopefully, it will get to the point to where people in Jackson won't have to go to Madison or Rankin County for anything.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-21T00:28:13-06:00

ID

80471

Comment

Great article, JFP. It's so nice to have a dose of great news mixed in with all of the Melonhead drama. It's amazing that the C-L won't even touch things like this... It's also interesting that there are only 2 responses to this article (which gives details about projects that will truly change the face of Jackson) and there are countless responses to anything related to Melonhead and his antics. Maybe the C-L really knows that people want to read about. I also find it horrifying that the OCG project might have never happened outside of GO Zone incentives. That single project will change so many things about the city, and it might not've happened without the worst natural disaster in US history raping our coast. Jackson will end up being better for it and the coast undoubtedly will, too.

Author

millhouse

Date

2006-09-21T11:23:51-06:00

ID

80472

Comment

Agreed, Millhouse. Every birthday issue, we focus on the city's progress, being that that is such a vital part of our mission. This one happened to fall at a really good time. I think the comments will take off here. Hang in there. JFP readers love eco-devo. ;-)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-21T11:33:39-06:00

ID

80473

Comment

Great article! It IS good to read positive news about Jackson for a change. Now if they would just hurry up and announce the convention center hotel....

Author

tombarnes

Date

2006-09-21T12:24:33-06:00

ID

80474

Comment

now now Millhouse!..... the expats are just now reading and studying this article it is well written and in depth and covers alot.....we will respond....

Author

ATLExile

Date

2006-09-21T14:11:28-06:00

ID

80475

Comment

Exactly! I know the ex-pat eco-devo freaks will start chiming in any time. Face it: Every one of y'all are going to come on home at some point. Get used to it. And watch out for that homing device going off. ;-)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-21T14:53:21-06:00

ID

80476

Comment

This article makes me so happy that I want to cry. I'm so glad to see Jackson on the verge of all this redevelopment.

Author

kelligann

Date

2006-09-21T19:39:04-06:00

ID

80477

Comment

Adam, What great news! Great article. This gives me hope for the future of Jackson. Do you have any more details or links to developer websites? I'm hungry for more to read about these great projects. Keep up the good work.

Author

FriendsofJackson

Date

2006-09-21T20:18:51-06:00

ID

80478

Comment

"Face it: Every one of y'all are going to come on home at some point". It's a matter of time with me.....workin my angle now..... So this article has really given a fantastic snapshot of the plate. And I agree with Golden Eagle Boy....but will draw a paralle with ATL. The many of us that live inside the perimeter have no business outside and rarely venture into the burbs. There is really not much out there that would interest urban dwellers. We do indeed have the best and better inside the city limits. That's is what will happen in the center of Jackson. Heck...we are just now getting big box retail like Wal-Marts inside Atlanta (as example of big box retail needs). We had no room! Whenever they build something like a new urban scaled retail center they have to tear down a four block area to pull off the minimum. But it works. Atlantic Station is a prime example cept that was 67 acres of steel mill first. But you guys are now getting started on some really cool stuff. My point is that Atlanta's rebirth started downtown and is still going on. The thing about Jackson is that the city center is relatively small as compared to most other cities in the South and the things about to go on down there will significantly impact the downtown area and most definitely start a catalyst. And if they pick these guys from New York then they can possibly bring in retail that would otherwise not have considered the area for some time. You guys are ready for a regional Macy's anyway...... Also it was interesting to read how the Melton Admin seems to hae thrown a wrench into the works where ever it could be done advertently or inadvertently. Gives a good view as to the delays. Did Mary ever get her House?.......Habitat puts one up how fast??????

Author

ATLExile

Date

2006-09-21T20:48:37-06:00

ID

80479

Comment

You know, I'm happy to see Jackson has something to look forward to. A Polaris to guide it through the choppy waters of political scandal, if you will, so that Jackson won't just be remembered for the corruption of an unjust mayor. Mostly because Jackson was my stomping grounds as a youth. I spent many hours in places like the Living Room, wasted many quarters in Diamond Jim's, roamed free across the city with my friends. Those places are gone now, but it is good that perhaps soon, other things will replace them that one day my own kids, or their kids, may enjoy. What I find rather sad, however, is that in order to paint this nice portrait of Jackson, Mr. Lynch, and a majority of the people on this site, feel it necessary to tell anyone who isn't in Jackson that they are inferior by default. I particularly loved the remark on page 17, in the small sidebar about Jackson lawyers, in which the remark "gormless cowfields" was attributed to my current residence, Ridgeland. It has apparently become fashionable if you are a Jacksonian to talk trash about, well, nearly everywhere else. In fighting the negativity of other places about Jackson's current conditions, many Jacksonians have apparently taken up the exact same tactic: insulting and belittling the opinions of others based solely on geographic location. So instead of feeling like Jackson wants my business, my companionship, I feel more and more that Jackson just wants to be left alone. Which is fine. I don't mind not coming where I'm not welcome. On the other hand, by putting up those walls, exactly how do you expect to make people feel like they are welcome to come to Jackson, for whatever reason, to contribute to it in any meaningful way? Nobody in Ridgeland feels the need to justify their choice of residence or business by making snide remarks in publications. When asked if we know a good place to eat, or shop, or whatever, we just tell them the places we know of to find that sort of thing. Sure, we tell folks crime is high in Jackson. Sure is. I got a supervisor living there who was robbed 3 times in as many months; the last time, they came back 3 times for multiple trips to carry off his goods. None of your great citizens reported it, and what they couldn't cart off, they vandalized out sheer spite. I'm sure if he leaves you'll brand him a coward and a quitter, but whatever. The point is, I may live in Ridgeland, but people I give a damn about still live in Jackson. Throwing up this "Us vs. Them" tripe is about as stupid as it gets (unlike Mr. Lynch, I don't need to resort to obscure vocabulary to say the word "stupid"; he may wish to use such gormless tactics, but not I). It doesn't do anything for anyone, except make for good controversy on the blogs and websites it gets posted to. If Mr. Lynch, and others, were truly interested in combating the negative perception of Jackson, they might try a more positive approach. Instead of simply stating one's opinion that other towns are "stupid cowfields", perhaps it would be better to simply talk about the good things in Jackson on their own merit, rather than a silly attempt to court the favor of people already living here by painting other places as inferior. I've never had to compare any place in Ridgeland, Madison, Pearl, or anywhere else, to Jackson in order to get people to go there. Usually, just talking about the place's merits alone is enough for people to make up their mind. If people can't do the same with places in Jackson, perhaps the focus needs to be on how to make Jackson-area opportunities more appealing, instead of waging a mudslinging battle with the rest of the Metro area. Seems like it would be a far more positive way to do things. But, what do I know? I'm a filthy, stupid outsider. Nobody could possibly be interested in my ridiculous opinion. So don't mind me. I'm sure one person's opinion never really made a difference.

Author

Eindrachen

Date

2006-09-21T21:44:59-06:00

ID

80480

Comment

Eindrachen, nobody called anybody a filthy, stupid outsider, for Pete's sake. Furthermore, Adam insulted fields, not people. Perhaps that seems like sophistry, but there is a difference between saying Ridgeland is lame and saying people from Ridgeland are lame, isn't there? That aside, Jackson has good reason to be wary of its suburbs. They are literally parasites feeding off the urban core. They contribute no taxes to maintaining the city, and they arose out of white flight. Many of the problems Jackson faces were caused--literally caused--by the rise of the suburbs. If those surrounding communities were incorporated into Jackson--and I know that's not practical, but I'm saying it to illustrate a point--our budgetary problems would disappear overnight. And maybe, just maybe, all those white folks living in Brandon and Ridgeland et al. would have some interest in addressing the needs of our urban, black poor. Instead, they are indifferent, if not downright gleeful, at Jackson's decline. It gets hard to hear after a while.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2006-09-22T11:32:20-06:00

ID

80481

Comment

Brian, Ein has whined here before about the 'burbs being misunderstood. My suggestion is to ignore him. The funny part to me is how much this narrative has reversed in the last four years. It used to be us urbanites being defensive; now the shoe is on the other foot because people are realizing how cool it is to live int he city and help with its creative renaissance. Also, it's important to realize that facing the limitations of suburban living is not the same thing as hating on people who choose such a lifestyle.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T11:36:39-06:00

ID

80482

Comment

I know the ex-pat eco-devo freaks will start chiming in any time. Face it: Every one of y'all are going to come on home at some point. I start my new job in Jackson on November 1. As for the "eco-devo" part, I'll comment on one thing here. I do NOT like the idea of a Wal-Mart cluttering up West Capitol Street. Big-box developments do not belong in cities (a lesson I also hope Jersey City, NJ, learns really soon). See y'all soon! :-D Best, Tim

Author

Tim Kynerd

Date

2006-09-22T13:05:04-06:00

ID

80483

Comment

Nobody in Ridgeland feels the need to justify their choice of residence or business by making snide remarks in publications. Excuse me? Have you read the Clarion-Ledger in, say, oh, I don't know, the last twenty years or so? Do you ever read the letters to the editor? Jackson's suburbs and their inhabitants have been continually ragging on Jackson for as long as I can remember. As far as I'm concerned, it's about time Jackson got a little of its own back. Donna got it right: The funny part to me is how much this narrative has reversed in the last four years. It used to be us urbanites being defensive; now the shoe is on the other foot because people are realizing how cool it is to live int he city and help with its creative renaissance. -- Tim

Author

Tim Kynerd

Date

2006-09-22T13:14:17-06:00

ID

80484

Comment

Eindrachen, the type of decorum you call for would be laudable, were it possible. The debate between Jackson v. burbs went personal a long time ago. And it started with suburbanites talking negatively about our city. As a visual example of that, Ridgeland (or was it Madison) put up a billboard in Jackson on the interstate saying something to the effect of not being the last one to turn out the lights. On the tacky meter, that's pretty far up there. You have a history here, so I'm sure you remember that billboard. I still can't believe someone had such bad judgement to put up a sign like that. In my opinion, today, the negativity is vocalized much more by suburbanites, not Jacksonians. It is very PC to trash Jackson. I've never been in a state where it is so PC to trash the capital city or the state's major city. Even in states where those cities have major problems. We've been put on the defensive for a long, long time. At some point, people started fighting back because they got sick of taking BS from people who left. Some of that fighting back gets negative. Maybe that is not ideal, but that is the reality.

Author

MAllen

Date

2006-09-22T13:17:12-06:00

ID

80485

Comment

Tim, this rocks! Welcome back to Jackson! Re suburbs: You know, I have lots of friends that live in the suburbs. While there's no denying the fact that white flight is white flight, there are other valid reasons to live there--they're quieter, more peaceful, the sky is actually black at night because it doesn't have the city lights on it (though personally, I find them comforting), there's a lot more undeveloped terrain to walk around in, you can buy bigger chunks of land cheaper and do fun things with them, you can (depending on how busy the area is) let your cats be indoor-outdoor without worrying as much about whether they get run over, and so on and so forth. I'm not saying the suburbs have nothing to recommend them. I'm saying "Jackson has been going downhill since integration" is not one of those things. I mean, city life just isn't for some people, and that's okay. That's not a slam on Jackson, any more than pistachio ice cream is a slam on butter pecan. But for those of us who want to live in the middle of what's going on--with all that implies, both good and bad--Jackson is fantastic. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-22T14:47:20-06:00

ID

80486

Comment

And I agree that the anti-Jackson rhetoric does get nasty. Y'all know how much I love my "Suburban Theogony" pet term, but for those of y'all who haven't heard the definition, the belief goes like this: 1. That Jackson was, prior to integration, a paradise. 2. That integration created crime and destroyed the culture of Jackson. 3. That Jackson is completely irredeemable and will one day collapse entirely. 4. That the suburbs will rise--or have already risen--as the real capital of Mississippi, serving the function that Jackson served prior to integration. It's a racist belief system, implicitly bought into by the mainstream media, and one that I'd like to fight. But are there other, more valid reasons to live in the 'burbs? Of course. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-22T15:42:35-06:00

ID

80487

Comment

I'm really happy and excited that Jackson is on the cusp of all this development. I hope that everything works out exactly as planned, or hopefully even better than planned. It's all good for those that live in Jackson, and it's all good for those of us that live in the suburbs. There, I've extended the olive branch- now, will some of you city dwellers finally come see a baseball game in Pearl, or a movie in Madison- new theaters and new stadiums in the area are also good for all of us. We are 10 minutes from downtown- it isn't like you have to climb a brick wall or anything... New development in the area benefits everyone in the area, not just those on one side of an imaginary line.

Author

Rico

Date

2006-09-22T16:56:05-06:00

ID

80488

Comment

Yay for Jackson. Even so, I am worried about the Wal Marts going up in West Jackson, which would cut entrepreneurship opportunities for West Jackson residents. Also, I'd keep a weather eye on the nature of the "spiffier" developments - make sure the architecture has an authentic feel rather than a yuppiefied-faux hip feel. Keeping the old buildings for reuse, along with their rather gritty feel, is a major part of retaining an appealing atmosphere: Grittier feeling places, for some reason, allow many people to be their authentic selves by acting as a counterweight to consumerist-materialist-image snobbery attitudes so prevalent in much of society -- not just among Jackson Metronians themselves (well, that's my view anyway, I don't know about anyone else). As for the city vs burbs thing -- It depends on what kind of personality/family/etc combination you have. Even within the same socio-economic group (race by income, for example), each part of a city tends to attract people with a certain mentality. This is true even within the same socio-economic status. Suburbs offer more "familiarity" for those with conventional values and tastes, space for kids to play in, and (at least in the north Jackson burbs) more water/outdoor opportunities. Cities tend to have a high concentration of cultural opportunities, diversity, and more open to experimentation. It's a matter of personal preference. Although I tend to not like suburbs very much myself, finger-pointing - whether from city dwellers or suburbanites - serves no constructive purpose.

Author

Philip

Date

2006-09-22T17:22:45-06:00

ID

80489

Comment

We live in Clinton. That is no secret. Clinton has the Nature Center and Kids Towne. Not much else to do with children. Jackson has the Natural Science Museum, which is always an awesome trip: the Planetarium (thumbs up to Gary), the Jackson Zoo, the Ag Museum, great historical events like Versailles and Majesties of Spain (I'll tell you the story of that trip sometime!), so many wonderful museums and historical sites... As much as we love Clinton, the educational opportunities in Jackson are far superior. There's so much good in both.

Author

Lady Havoc

Date

2006-09-22T18:04:12-06:00

ID

80490

Comment

Agreed, Lady H. Jackson can be very kid friendly and educational for children and families. Don't forget that just being the Capital of MS allows a bonus opportunity for educational fieldtrips!

Author

pikersam

Date

2006-09-22T18:08:41-06:00

ID

80491

Comment

That's the truth. We miss going to the Old Capitol. We've been several times, and the kids have gone on field trips, and we love it. We can't wait for it to reopen, and hope they didn't lose a lot of their collection due to Katrina. Our son loves the Old Capitol. We've been to the new one, but it just isn't the same somehow. When we go on trips, we always include a bit of history. On our trip to KY next year, we'll be traipsing through cemeteries, trying to piece together my ancestry. The kids know their dad's family, but mine had all passed on before I even met IG. I hope this will give them an appreciation for the side of the family they'll never really know...

Author

Lady Havoc

Date

2006-09-22T18:19:07-06:00

ID

80492

Comment

Philip, I think it's a very hard sell that moving to the suburbs is about a lifestyle choice based primarily on your preference in entertainment. When I hear people talk about moving to the suburbs, they put in the context of fleeing "JAfrica," which is like "Rwanda," to quote a particularly confused caller to the Kim Wade Show today. I just don't buy that moving to the suburbs is some white-as-snow lifestyle choice. Or rather, I think that's EXACTLY what it is.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2006-09-22T18:25:51-06:00

ID

80493

Comment

Brian, I certainly agree this is the case much of the time. I, on the other hand, was looking at more "universal" patterns (for example, almost-lilly-white metros like Minneapolis and Seattle). Even without the race issue, a lot of people think of cities proper as repositories of "moral filth", "weirdos", and "dangerous ideas that threaten our traditions" regardless of the city's ethnic makeup.

Author

Philip

Date

2006-09-22T18:39:30-06:00

ID

80494

Comment

Brian, the problem with chalking it all up to white flight is that even in white-as-snow urban areas in New England, people move to the 'burbs. I agree that white flight is a problem, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's the only or primary factor motivating suburban growth. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-22T19:08:20-06:00

ID

80495

Comment

Its not always about race. Suppose I have a wife, two kids, and I want to get a 2200 sq. ft. brand new house that is new construction. Where could I go get one in Jackson? Its not like there are many new subdivisions in Jackson to choose from.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T19:30:08-06:00

ID

80496

Comment

IF watkins is smart, and we know he is, he'll put that sushi bar on top of the whole building. Tsunami did that with the Shaw center in Baton Rouge and it became the biggest hit because of its view of the city and its outdoor patio.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T19:32:45-06:00

ID

80497

Comment

No one said it is "always" about race. (I hate that phrase.) But, in the state of Mississippi as well as other places, it is *often* about race. Denying that doesn't help anything.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T19:54:20-06:00

ID

80498

Comment

And you gotta love that the same guy you called Jackson "Jafrica" came back and tried to say that his problems about Jackson aren't about race. Typical.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T19:55:20-06:00

ID

80499

Comment

KF brings up the exact problem I've been having. I want 2600 sf for my family, preferably new, and right now most of the *better* options are just outside of Jackson. It's not impossible to find such a house in Jackson, but the choices are few and far in between.

Author

Jeff Lucas

Date

2006-09-22T20:00:09-06:00

ID

80500

Comment

I caught that Jafrica comment and was stunned. Sometimes you see or hear something so racist that you are at a loss for words. Then later he had the nerve to say he was a product of Jackson Public Schools. If he's the best JPS had to offer back in the day, I'm REALLY not impressed.

Author

Jeff Lucas

Date

2006-09-22T20:03:12-06:00

ID

80501

Comment

Agreed, ejeff. Kim and I just stared at each other in horror. Times like this people's true selves float to the top (or sink to the bottom?). Ugly, nasty stuff.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T20:04:54-06:00

ID

80502

Comment

Forget the race part. Suppose you are a Black family and want to build or buy a new house for 2600 or so square feet. Where in Jackson can you get such a house? There is not much in the way of choice when it comes to buying new homes in Jackson.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T20:13:27-06:00

ID

80503

Comment

We can't forget the race part. It's part of our history, and we won't solve problems by refusing to face the reasons they are there–including racism. You can't ignore it.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T20:14:51-06:00

ID

80504

Comment

No one is ignoring it. In fact, I'll submit to you that the race part is usually the ONLY thing talked about before crime and taxes. However, I am also pointing out that there are alot of people moving out of Jackson for other reasons and real estate is one of the major ones. In case you haven't noticed, Black people are moving out as well so the race issue doesn't always fly.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T20:19:54-06:00

ID

80505

Comment

In fact, I'll submit to you that the race part is usually the ONLY thing talked about before crime and taxes. Oh yeah, we have just gone. to. town. facing the problems that this state's racism caused us over the years. Not buying it, Kingfish. Sure, talk about all the problems, but don't downplay the role of race. That's intellectually dishonest.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T20:21:52-06:00

ID

80506

Comment

Donna writes: But, in the state of Mississippi as well as other places, it is *often* about race. Agreed, and I want to make it clear that I don't believe otherwise. I don't want to spray paint over white flight; I'm just saying that there are other, legitimate reasons to move to the suburbs, too. ejeff writes: I caught that Jafrica comment and was stunned. Sometimes you see or hear something so racist that you are at a loss for words. "Jafrica"? Lord have mercy. I'm kind of glad I missed it now. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-22T20:29:48-06:00

ID

80507

Comment

I'm not downplaying the role of race. However, I work for a company that wholesales to mortgage companies. That means I get a look at who is buying houses, where they are buying houses, what type of houses, their race, etc. there are alot of Blacks and whites that have moved into new subdivisions. Enough to where I can't say they are leaving jackson because of the race issue. I see this stuff from several mortgage companies around town. One of the main reasons based on what I see is that there are no new subdivisions being built. I am VERY aware of the race factor and how quite a few people have moved that think like that caller who sounded like an idiot. However, I am merely stating it is not the only reason. I've seen the for sale signs in too many neighborhoods pop up when a few Black folk move in then they get scared and move. However, I think most of the people who have moved for that reason have already done so. You still have people moving out of Jackson and i can tell you from what I see in the real estate/mortgage business alot of Black people are included in that group. Thus I make the case that while Race is a major factor in the migration, that the lack of options for real estate is a major factor as well. Can you name for me ANY new subdivisions in Jackson? Yet I can ask anyone and I'll be they can name a couple in Madison or Rankin .Yet none in Jackson.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T20:30:04-06:00

ID

80508

Comment

We'll post the show next week so everyone can hear the non-racist use of the word "Jafrica" for yourself. Kingfish, of course, black people are moving to the suburbs, too. But it is disingenuous not to look back to the original causes of suburban flight—that left inner-city neighborhoods poverty-striken and, thus, led to crime. It's also vital to understand the effects of 200 years of slavery and Jim Crow on young black men.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-22T20:36:25-06:00

ID

80509

Comment

KF, there are a couple of new subdivisions in south Jackson, one at Raymond Road and another at McCluer Road (i think). They are not on the level of a Crossgates, but they are fair sized and within the city limits. Neither of them are the controversial "rent-to-own" developments that were being proposed last summer. But I understand your main point that the bulk of new housing construction is going on in Rankin and Madison County, or in the Byram community. Most of the development in Jackson is subdividing existing large lots into 2 or 3 separate lots; there are several of those in NE Jackson.

Author

Jeff Lucas

Date

2006-09-22T20:38:12-06:00

ID

80510

Comment

you want people to move back is the point, right? Where do they move to is my point? I'm looking at the economic aspect of this issue. You still have not answered my query as to where they would move to if they want to buy a new house in Jackson. This has been ignored for the most part BUT it is the thing that will bring in more property and sales tax revenue. We can look at original causes all day. But looking at origins is not the same as providing solutions. One solution is you have to give people a reason to move back to the city. Here in baton rouge they went through that migration to Livinston and Ascension Parishes. Now some of the hottest developments are off of River Road and are near downtown BR. People are snapping those properites up like hotcakes (Lake Beau Pre for example for you peole that want to verify what I am saying). However, there is nothing in the way of new residential development on a nice sized scale to entice people to move back to Jackson.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T20:42:51-06:00

ID

80511

Comment

Good point ejeff. You know the poing I am trying to make. Nothing really like Cornerstone, Ashbrook, Ambience, etc. One idea I've always had is this. Tear down Chatam Village, and all those apt's on the corner of Old Canton Road and Ridgewood. Build either patio homes or condos. In fact, have part or all of it be a retirement community. Keep prices for condos/patio homes under 175K, build a nice little lake in the middle. It would be across from Parham bridges, pretty close to shops etc. Have it gated so crime is not an issue. It would have access to parks, schools, public transportation if need be, and be a good location. If was the city, I'd give a developer a tax break on developing it because the property taxes would bring in more revenue.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-22T20:47:44-06:00

ID

80512

Comment

I think this "everybody's moving out of Jackson" deal is quite overblown now. Of course, I can't deny that there are still people who are moving out to the surrounding areas. But if there is quite a demand for people to move into downtown, something tells me that the trend of people moving out of the city should began to reverse or slow down significantly. There isn't a lot of available land left in Jackson to build large-scale residential subdivisions. But even the city is successful in annexing Byram or any large area of Hinds County, my guess is that developers won't be rushing to build homes there. Seems to me that anything that would be built within the city limits won't sell and that needs to change. One comment about downtown: that new Miami-styled lifestyle center that will be built on the old Clements Cadillac looks quite futuristic, like something you'd see on The Jetson. Definitely looks different, so it won't be cookie-cutter. I'm very excited about downtown's future.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-22T22:50:53-06:00

ID

80513

Comment

Are there any pictures of this development? It sounds very interesting.

Author

tombarnes

Date

2006-09-22T23:49:51-06:00

ID

80514

Comment

People in the suburbs are in a win-win situation. If conditions in Jackson go downhill, there will always be people wanting to get out and move to the suburbs, and our property values will go up. On the other hand, if Jackson can become an exciting new destination for people on the move (and I have every reason in the world to believe that it could happen), then suburban real estate will skyrocket along with Jackson's- we really aren't that far away from downtown! I want Jackson to do well... I moved out here for the same reason as most of the other people I know- this is where they were building the houses. Build 'em in Jackson and they will come.

Author

Rico

Date

2006-09-23T00:06:31-06:00

ID

80515

Comment

Actually, white flight is no longer fueling the exodus to the burbs. New familities and people moving into the Jackson area irregardless of color are not choosing Jackson. And, many Africian-American families are moving out of Jackson because of crime, the type of housing product they do not find in Jackson, and better schools. This is not theory--it is factual information from real estate salespeople who are interacting with families everyday.

Author

realtime

Date

2006-09-23T09:16:07-06:00

ID

80516

Comment

First, excuse this long blog. I'm very weary with the "Jackson vs. burbs" fights that seem to consume so much of everyone's energy. Yes, there are worthless jerks ("Jafrica, for Christ's sake) out there. But, folks, we're on this planet only a short period of time. Why not try to make it better for the folks who come behind us. If we could all spend a little more time and energy trying to figure out how to solve common problems, create new paradigms and dream a bit about what could be (some people call that thinking out of the box), then we could make gigantic strides moving forward, rather than moving laterally. The truth is the City of Jackson needs help from ALL quarters to become, not just "as good as it used to be" (whatever that means), but a great American city for the 21st century. This is NOT impossible. Yes, there are race issues; crime issues (which are real), and the perception of crime (which in many cases is way overblown; e.g., there is very little crime in the central business district, that is a fact). Yet, Jackson, the city, has all of the ingredients necessary to transcend Jackson into a new place, a new, dynamic and exciting place. We have a plethora of developable properties and areas within the city; we have a tremendous amount of green space (just look all around from the University Club); we have very few serious environmental problems; we have relatively cheap land; we have a growing Black middle class with ever-growing financial power and an improving education system that is a real sleeper. Kids in JPS are getting an excellent education; JPS grads are excelling. Most folks don't realize that there are SEVEN level 5 (superior) schools in Jackson. That, with a 99% African-American population, with 86% of the children from families that are considered to be in poverty and with over 65% of the children coming from single parent families. Quietly, but steadily, there is a revolution going on in the school system. These kids are getting a good education, and getting good training in moral values, in spite of the challenges they face. In truth, this is a classic all-American story of the underdogs working their butts off to seize the American dream. Yes, there is a small minority of "bad" kids out there. But, the vastly overwhelming majority of these kids are sweet, loving and hungry from knowledge, just like all of the little kids out in the suburbs. Jackson, the future. Just think with me for a minute, close your eyes and fast forward about 10 years. If we are only 75% successful with the developments that are already planned, if the school district continues to improve at preparing our children for college and the work force the way they have been over the last 5 years, then the City of Jackson will transform to something totally different from today. I see significant migration TO the city, not necessarily from the suburbs, but from other towns in Mississippi and from other states. And, why not? Good schools, good value for housing, good recreation and entertainment, and a safe environment. Isn't that what we're all looking for? Will it be easy? Hell no. It will require forward thinking leaders in the City AND in the metro area who are not afraid of competition and who are not jealous of each other because of petty, race, class and/or historical issues. We simply don't have time for that. If Jackson prospers, so will Metro Jackson. If Jackson fails, then not only does Metro Jackson suffer, but the WHOLE STATE suffers. Ok, sorry to preach, folks. 2. Wal-mart in West Jackson: while I'm not into big box development, this one is different. This is a single tactical, not strategic, move that is designed solely as a catalyst for development, blight removal and generation of tax dollars within the city. The development will be similar to the Madison wal-mart - red bricks and all. The fact is, the data tells us that this single move would do more to foster OTHER developments than any other single move. While NOBODY makes any money off of a Walmart development except for Walmart, every business within a half mile of walmart will experience an increase in traffic and increased revenue opportunities.

Author

Pops

Date

2006-09-23T11:30:08-06:00

ID

80517

Comment

Like the cliche says, "if you build it, they will come". As much as some deride Jackson's past, do we really want those days back as such? Or do we want what other cities have done, and that is revitalize downtown?

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T13:24:32-06:00

ID

80518

Comment

MORE INFO One comment about downtown: that new Miami-styled lifestyle center that will be built on the old Clements Cadillac looks quite futuristic, like something you'd see on The Jetson. Definitely looks different, so it won't be cookie-cutter. I'm very excited about downtown's future. Are there any pictures of this development? It sounds very interesting. YES go to: DT Jackson Slides and look for slides 45 through 48 - It's called Ceva-Green.

Author

Pops

Date

2006-09-23T13:28:32-06:00

ID

80519

Comment

Like the cliche says, "if you build it, they will come". As much as some deride Jackson's past, do we really want those days back as such? Or do we want what other cities have done, and that is revitalize downtown? I think the key to Jackson's future is to look at what other cities have done and do it better...

Author

Rico

Date

2006-09-23T13:41:46-06:00

ID

80520

Comment

RICO SAID: I think the key to Jackson's future is to look at what other cities have done and do it better... I COULDN'T AGREE MORE!

Author

Pops

Date

2006-09-23T13:58:08-06:00

ID

80521

Comment

Yup, Rico. It's always better to learn from the mistakes of others.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T13:58:28-06:00

ID

80522

Comment

Good points Pops (aka King Eddy)! You are not preaching, you are expressing what most everyone wants for Jackson. The Jackson Renaissance began in a few years back and now we are moving forward. But, I want to use some points you have made to show why Jackson is in peril by a continued support from certain elected officials and business leaders for Melton's criminal violations, his disregard for true public safety, and the negative attention he is bringing Jackson. King Eddy, you are one of the good ones here in town. Yet, Jackson, the city, has all of the ingredients necessary to transcend Jackson into a new place, a new, dynamic and exciting place. We have a plethora of developable properties and areas within the city; we have a tremendous amount of green space (just look all around from the University Club); we have very few serious environmental problems; we have relatively cheap land; we have a growing Black middle class with ever-growing financial power and an improving education system that is a real sleeper. You are absolutely right! We have a great, wonderful, growing Black middle class. But, what has happened is that NE Jax has tossed aside the Black middle class in Jackson in favor of a Mayor, who is described by the black hate mongers as "the peoples mayor." Yet, this has embolden the very "thugs" that they so despise. The negative image of Jackson is growing. This has created a huge divide in Jackson, that has left both Black and some white middle class families in the middle - drowning so to speak. These are the same families we need to foster to make sure Jackson does grow in a way that improves the culture of Jackson at the same time in increases the tax base. This same Black (and white) middle class will soon be moving into suburbs up Hwy 49, into Clinton and Madison if Jackson's leaders continue to hold on to the past vestiges of black vs. white as those on each extreme continue to use Race as the guiding point. Melton is the rally guy for both extreme sides. Jackson is in peril of taking two or three steps backwards if we continue to embrace this most divisive situation that Melton and his people have created. Who are going to mentor tomorrows youth if you drive all the small business owners, up and coming atty's/doctors, teachers, etc out of Jackson or even worst Hinds? What will Jackson do if the young creative class leaves for more youthful cities outside Central MS? If opportunities for young Jacksonians are dried up then they will go elsewhere. The late 80's and early 90's are evident of that. Will it be easy? Hell no. It will require forward thinking leaders in the City AND in the metro area who are not afraid of competition and who are not jealous of each other because of petty, race, class and/or historical issues. We simply don't have time for that. If Jackson prospers, so will Metro Jackson. If Jackson fails, then not only does Metro Jackson suffer, but the WHOLE STATE suffers. You are absolutely right again. However, what is happening right now is these "forward thinking leaders" are trying to tell us that we should somehow believe that Melton has done this; and that we should excuse his lack of regard for the law as "his heart being in the right place," and that he is good for Jackson. He's learning; but, look we are bringing a new arena to Downtown. That does not make it right that this man is dangerous to Jackson's overall image. It does not make it right that he has broken the law. It is a no brain'er that Jackson's business leaders and elected leaders should be united to show Jackson is bigger than Melton and ask Mayor Melton to resign; not in three months, but this week! Why drag this out? What are they protecting? Any other town, any other mayor, and this is over two weeks ago. Most normal communities do not put up with the kind of crap Melton is doing. The over glamorized crime sweeps which have only increased Jackson's crime problem, the cursing at citizens on TV, or the egregious behavior on that fateful evening are all detrimental to the overall health of Jackson. Melton has brought a negative image of Jackson into homes across America. That only isolates us more and lends credibility to the theory that MS is still all backwards a$$. I am so glad much of the new development will occur despite Melton. But, I cannot endorse the theory that Jackson is moving forward because of Melton. Nor that we would not be in this position without Melton. Jackson is far better off without Melton at the helm.

Author

pikersam

Date

2006-09-23T14:29:35-06:00

ID

80523

Comment

This isn't exactly downtown, but did you all hear about the groundbreaking earlier this week for the new machinery company that will be built on Industrial Drive? WJTV article

Author

LatashaWillis

Date

2006-09-23T14:45:44-06:00

ID

80524

Comment

Original Pikersam Touche' Make no mistake, I believe that leadership is the key. We certainly do not have it in the Mayor's Office right now. I personally believe that the honorable and the bravest thing that Frank could do is to resign now, for the good of the city. period. Having said that, I submit: 1. we must recruit, train and nurture new and future leaders for this city 2. we must accentuate the positive, while still addressing the negative 3. we must do a better job of working together (Blacks & Whites, North & South, Rich & Poor, Metro and City); 4. there is a responsiblity and a role for EVERY single person to do something to help this situation; every Jacksonian should ask what he or she could do, in his or her own way, to make a difference. I would suggest that more people in the metro area should feel a kinship with our city and should consider themselves Jacksonians, in the sense that JFK proclaimed in 1962 that he was "a Berliner." In fact, EVERY MISSISSIPPIAN should, to some degree, be a Jacksonian and want Jackson to prosper and to reflect positively on this state.

Author

Pops

Date

2006-09-23T15:35:23-06:00

ID

80525

Comment

"This same Black (and white) middle class will soon be moving into suburbs up Hwy 49, into Clinton and Madison if Jackson's leaders continue to hold on to the past vestiges of black vs. white as those on each extreme continue to use Race as the guiding point." Black middle class families (and white) have been moving out of West Jackson into Clinton and out of South Jackson into Byram for two decades. Most cite high crime and higher taxes as being the motivation as well as the lure of better public schools in smaller towns or in the County. Homebuyers typically chose the community first and the house second, although newer upscale homes can be a draw. The head of the household always makes the decision they think is best for their familiy especially their children. Yuppies and emply nesters have more flexibility, because the school issue does not apply. Homebuilders follow the market, thus we are seeing new (very expensive) homes being built on infill lots in NE Jackson. This type of buyer can afford higher taxes, seclude themselves behind gates and send chlldren to private schools.

Author

realtime

Date

2006-09-23T16:07:50-06:00

ID

80526

Comment

Sorry I dropped out of the thread for a bit, but I just wanted to say that I never wrote that white flight was the ONLY cause of relocation to the suburbs or that white flight was the cause of all suburbs per se. (Nevertheless, many, many Northern suburbs did arise from white flight; not all.) White flight is certainly the cause of Jackson's suburbs though. I know that many individuals move to the suburbs for an assortment of reasons that have nothing to do with race. But structurally speaking, our suburbs exploded as the African-American population of Jackson grew and the schools were integrated. I do not think that we are anywhere near the end of this cultural adjustment to the end of legal racism. A cynical way of looking at the accomodation between the federal government, i.e. Northern states, and the South in the 1960s and 70s is that the North told the South it had to be racist like the North. In other words, flee urban cores for suburbs, defund public schools, restrict lending, criminalize the urban poor, strip the city of both tax and investment dollars. But for God's sake don't make it a matter of law. That's racism. Leaving poor blacks who couldn't even attend universities until 40 years ago to fend for themselves in an urban core? That's just business. I lived in Milwaukee, Wis., for several years, and it was far more segregated than Jackson. Many of the African-Americans there were from Jackson, or at least Mississippi. Like Jackson, it was majority non-white, about 65 percent. The surburbs sprawled out in all directions, and they were majority white. Of course, Wisconsin never had Jim Crow, but it doesn't matter. The reason why Milwaukee's suburbs were white and its urban core black is racism. Individuals move to the surburbs for different reasons. Hell, surburbs were just somebody's home town until growth exploded. But I strongly believe that racism, both individual and institutional, is the main cause for suburban growth.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2006-09-23T16:19:25-06:00

ID

80527

Comment

Brian, I don't think it's healthy to think that any longer. Whatever the past may have been, it's better to conquer the future and rid it of fear rather than keep trying to fix the past. Jackson's past is done, written and sealed. The future can be much better.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T16:56:47-06:00

ID

80528

Comment

Brian, I don't think it's healthy to think that any longer. Whatever the past may have been, it's better to conquer the future and rid it of fear rather than keep trying to fix the past. Jackson's past is done, written and sealed. The future can be much better. Faulkner said it best (in Requiem for a Nun, I think): The past isn't dead. It isn't even past. Wal-mart in West Jackson: while I'm not into big box development, this one is different. How? Big box is big box is big box. What I want to see in Jackson is a lot more small-scale, mixed-use development that encourages forms of transportation other than the automobile. One good reason for Jackson to do this is that having people on the streets (walking, not in their cars) is just about the best way to keep the streets safe. No faintly realistic number of police officers can do the job that pedestrians can do just by using the streets. Big box development is a step in exactly the opposite (wrong, IMO) direction. Best, Tim

Author

Tim Kynerd

Date

2006-09-23T17:18:02-06:00

ID

80529

Comment

The Robert E. Lee will end up beinig like the "Dakota" of Jackson. It really looks like one of those high end luxury apartment buildings built on Central Park in the early 20th century....how grand!...Also the Rooftop ballrooms are some of the most well preserved period spaces in the city of Jackson. Equal to anything in the Fox Theater reception rooms over here.

Author

ATLExile

Date

2006-09-23T18:37:17-06:00

ID

80530

Comment

The old Robbie Lee is a wonderful building. Can't wait until someone complains about the name. It will happen.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T18:39:35-06:00

ID

80531

Comment

You know I have never really thought of Ridgeland as suburb of Jackson. Madison, Flowood, Pearl, and of course Brandon but not Ridge. You can't really tell where one ends and one begins, like Byram and Clinton. Also that area around Old Agency Road is shaping up to be one of the most handsome areas of the city. The character was always there and with the Trace and the preservation of the tree canopy it all seems so established now. Also those areas east where where Old Canton and the Trace come to play are really shaping up as well. Scary how well I know the metro isn't it?.......you'll never be able to pull one over on me.....you know that don't you! you guy's have a great Saturday night and get off this blog!.....go to your watering holes or something......

Author

ATLExile

Date

2006-09-23T18:56:58-06:00

ID

80532

Comment

Brian, is Milwaukee not the bomb! I had the chance to spend a summer there. What a town!

Author

pikersam

Date

2006-09-23T19:06:07-06:00

ID

80533

Comment

"The old Robbie Lee is a wonderful building. Can't wait until someone complains about the name. It will happen." I would think that whoever does redo the Robert E. Lee would be likely to change the name. While I am generally in favor of preserving original names whenever and wherever possible, I don't see this as being an issue to be concerned about. I'd rather see the building preserved than worry about its name. Why stir up more controversy?

Author

tombarnes

Date

2006-09-23T21:56:12-06:00

ID

80534

Comment

I can think of about, oh, 300 names more relevant to Mississippi than some 19th-century Confederate general from Virginia... Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-23T22:19:02-06:00

ID

80535

Comment

Granted that a more relevant name to mississippi history could be found. Ironically, in my search, I'm trying to find out if the hotel was actually named after him and not a similarly named architect by the name name, who designed First Christian down on High Street. Curious.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T22:34:59-06:00

ID

80536

Comment

Robert E. Lee, the Confederate general, is pictured in old advertisements and post cards of the hotel. I think it's therefore safe to assume that the hotel was named for him. The hotel also has the sad distinction of having been deliberately closed by the former owners, the Gammon family, for reasons directly (and publicly) tied to the integration issue. They made no secret of their reasons either. Putting this aside, it's still a wonderful building and deserves to be preserved with whatever name the new owners may choose to place on the building. I'm just saying that it would be far easier (and less divisive) to ditch the old name in favor of something less likely to offend a large portion of Jackson's population. It would be another small way to show that the state is moving forward, rather than hailing allegiance to a man who may not be a hero to a great majority of the residents of Mississippi.

Author

tombarnes

Date

2006-09-23T23:09:24-06:00

ID

80537

Comment

Wal-mart in West Jackson Where in west Jackson? I hadn't heard about it.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-23T23:22:30-06:00

ID

80538

Comment

Oh, never mind. I didn't see the mention of the possible Wal-Mart in the article.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-23T23:25:49-06:00

ID

80539

Comment

It would be nice to put a Wal Mart actually in the city, rather than on the border. As to the Lee: Well, yes, Robert Lee's legacy is a bit muddled. But for the love of anyone up there listening could we name it after someone inspiring?

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-09-23T23:45:20-06:00

ID

80540

Comment

Gammill, not Gammon.

Author

tombarnes

Date

2006-09-23T23:56:58-06:00

ID

80541

Comment

Well, y'all know about my strong preference for renaming buildings after more inspiring figures--I'd love it if we lived in a city where folks could drive past the Fannie Lou Hamer Federal Building on their way to go boating at the James Meredith Reservoir--but if the Lee building is private property, I won't be entirely crushed if they don't change the name. It'd be a good gesture, but Lee was not as much of a depressing influence on his era that Eastland and Barnett were on theirs. I came away from my civil war studies convinced that Lee was no monster--that he was a well-intentioned but gullible man who had been brainwashed by monsters. A cautionary tale that we might be well served to pay attention to in the Melton era. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2006-09-24T00:21:04-06:00

ID

80542

Comment

I know Kingfish said this wayyy up there, but I completely thought of Tsunami in Baton Rouge when I saw that they were thinking about putting a sushi bar in the King Edward. Tsunami is on the top floor of the Shaw Center for the Arts, and it has a great view of the Mississippi River. http://www.shawcenter.org/flashHome.html Even if they don't put a sushi bar on the top floor, I can't wait to be able to walk inside the renovated King Edward.

Author

kelligann

Date

2006-09-24T19:09:20-06:00

ID

80543

Comment

Pops, hope you are reading this. Check out Tsunami in Baton Rouge. Talk to people at 225 magazine and they will tell you how that became the biggest draw downtown. It would definitely work up here. That outdoor patio of Tsunami's is the bomb. You could probably talk them into putting a franchise up here as well.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2006-09-24T19:15:21-06:00

ID

80544

Comment

Wow, this thread did really take off. Amazing discussion over the weekend about Jackson's renaissance. It'll take me a bit to catch up, though. One quick comment in response to Ironghost's statement: Whatever the past may have been, it's better to conquer the future and rid it of fear rather than keep trying to fix the past. Jackson's past is done, written and sealed. The future can be much better. Of course it can—but not if we don't face the past and understand how it affects the present and the future. That's the answer to the Mississippi Riddle—it's not about choosing between facing the past or building the future; it's take the first to do the second. We will stay stalled until we understand that.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-25T11:45:32-06:00

ID

80545

Comment

I'm from Houston, a city that has developed rapidly in about 8 years and is still becoming better. Even though it's much bigger than Jackson, it used to be somewhat where Jackson is now (economically). If a huge city can change in a short time span, then Jackson can definately progress if it stays focused. Speaking of the word focus: We should not focus on the poor race relations that have put Jackson in its current predicament. As a few have said above, that may be only some of the problem today. The vast majority leave the city because of its poor economy lacking is new housing developments and adequate jobs. We should instead focus on how to make the city a better place for all people: Housing, entertainment, crime reduction, beautification, culture and jobs. I also don't agree with the battles between the inner city and the suburbs either. Every city in this country has an inner city and its suburbs. In these times, we need both to be a diversified environment. Both inner city and suburbs are what make any metro area a wonderful place to live. I don't understand why we continue to honor legendary racists, having their names on today's buildings and local sites. These horrible men made life miserable for about 1/2 the people in this state. If the state/city can honor Barnett, Lee and Eastland for their minor accomplishments, then 20 years from now, the city needs to honor Melton's name on a prominent, well respected building somewhere. If we can overlook the tragic mistakes of Barnett, etc, we can overlook the mistakes of Melton as well. I say make the playing field fair and balanced. I so look forward to Jackson becoming a world-class city. I know it will happen, I can't wait for it to happen and when it happens, the whole country is going to smile. Peace to all.

Author

Designer23

Date

2006-09-25T13:21:58-06:00

ID

80546

Comment

I don't understand why we continue to honor legendary racists, having their names on today's buildings and local sites. These horrible men made life miserable for about 1/2 the people in this state. Amen, Designer. It's a crying shame. I don't think we should "focus" on the past, either. Acknowledge it honestly, and figure out how to reverse the problems it caused? Absolutely. That's the only way we'll accomplish this part of your post: We should instead focus on how to make the city a better place for all people: Housing, entertainment, crime reduction, beautification, culture and jobs. Look at it this week: We need an arsenal of tools to pick the city, and the state up, and make ourselves shine. One major tool is facing the past, learning from it, fixing what can be fixed. And a major, major reason to face the past is to unify the effort to move forward. It is the way to build trust and minimize lingering resentments. Telling people that "the past is over; don't look backward," all the while leaving "Ross Barnett" prominently on the reservoir, and "James O. Eastland" on the federal courthouse (of all places!) are just slaps delivered along with the proclamation that "all that's behind us!" If it was really behind us, we'd get the racists off the public institutions and the Confederate emblem out of the state flag. Those remain symbols of the work yet to be done. But, and here's the fun part, we do that work by unifying despite the people who don't want us to (whether Sun or Advocate crowds), facing the past and moving forward together. THAT is the third way. ;-) Great post, Designer. Welcome.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-25T13:32:26-06:00

ID

80547

Comment

2. Wal-mart in West Jackson: while I'm not into big box development, this one is different. This is a single tactical, not strategic, move that is designed solely as a catalyst for development, blight removal and generation of tax dollars within the city. The development will be similar to the Madison wal-mart - red bricks and all. The fact is, the data tells us that this single move would do more to foster OTHER developments than any other single move. While NOBODY makes any money off of a Walmart development except for Walmart, every business within a half mile of walmart will experience an increase in traffic and increased revenue opportunities. Pops, I enjoyed your "sermon" over the weekend even if I didn't have the thumb strength to respond via my Blackberry. The keys are just too small for blogging. :-) So, I'm getting to this late. First, I think you are so right to point out that certain myths -- like you can't live in Jackson because your kids won't get an education -- are important for us to move past in order to get Jackson development rolling. JPS is making great strides and offers some impressive programs. If I had kids, that's where they'd go. (I know I can say that lightly and I defer to all parents everywhere to make decisions for their own kids...but I'd heard too much good about JPS and where it's headed.) Now, having said that, I've got concerns about the big box thing. I'm not saying that Wal-Mart might not be able to catalyze development in West Jackson and make the world shiny, new and pretty for all comers -- I'm just saying that it seems to me that Wal-Mart has an abysmal track record in that arena. As an example, Wal-Mart's announcement last week that it was going to rock-bottom pricing on 30 or so generic drugs is just one cynical example...the expectation is that when people more all their pharmaceutical needs to Wal-Mart, including the high-profit name brands, it'll kill what's left of community drug stores in urban neighborhoods -- those that specialize in knowing you and being able to recommend the generic vs. the name brand when the 'script is vague enough. Likewise, I'd be *very* concerned that a Wal-Mart on West Capitol would eat into such accomplishments as the McDade's newly opened grocery business...Wal-Mart is notoriously predatory with both its competitor shopping and its end-cap pricing that convinces people they're getting the best deal when they aren't. West Jackson is also served by numerous small gas stations, convenience stores, hair salons, bank branches, car shops, small furniture stores...and so on, all of which I think would be harmed more than helped by Wal-Mart. And, yes, while Wal-Marts like the Madison store seem to serve as anchors for strip development that encourages some smaller, local businesses (I'm thinking of places like Roly-Poly) into their strip-shopping developments, isn't that a suburban formula? Would the West Capitol Wal-Mart really encourage development other than fast food? Or would it end up looking a little more like the Crossgates Wal-Mart...I picture a Sonic in the parking lot across from the Wal-Mart gas pumps and relatively little else. One thing that's thrilling about watching the McDades prosper is that they prove the rule as far as watching a local business reinvest its profits in the community -- they put well-managed stores that respond to consumer needs on the ground in places that chains have pulled out of and/or have no "formula" for serving. I'm concerned that Wal-Mart is more about undoing those successes than encouraging them...I'd love it if you could prove me wrong! And if we HAVE to go big box in West Jackson, why not think outside the Wal-Box? An easy answer might be coaxing an Old Navy into a new development location, perhaps something that drives the development you're envisioning without hurting so many existing businesses. Or, a yuppie mecca like H&M or IKEA -- something that would really swell the traffic lanes from Fondren and Belhaven and up and down 220 while serving up jobs and cheap, fashionable goods for area residents?

Author

Todd Stauffer

Date

2006-09-25T20:38:21-06:00

ID

80548

Comment

Pretty funny that the C-L had a similar article yesterday. It's also very fitting that only 20% of the article talked about Jackson development, with the rest dedicated to suburban projects.

Author

millhouse

Date

2006-09-25T21:26:06-06:00

ID

80549

Comment

Or, a yuppie mecca like H&M or IKEA Oh, my Lord, just imagine if, when I got back to Jackson, I didn't have to mail-order my last IKEA bookcase! Mmmmmmmm... (Plus, Swedish meatballs served up hot whenever I wanted them!) Todd, you've got me dreamin' now. (And actually there's some logic to having an IKEA in Jackson -- halfway between the current Atlanta and Houston locations; close enough to be reached from both Memphis and New Orleans -- why not? And there's already a community of Swedes in Jackson!) Best, Tim

Author

Tim Kynerd

Date

2006-09-26T08:51:58-06:00

ID

80550

Comment

Todd, why is yuppie big box more acceptable than WalMart? Wouldn't IKEA undercut Article and Max's and OffiSource and EveryDay Gardener, and local frame shops and local hardware stores, in the same way that WalMart undercuts McDade's and Brent's?

Author

kate

Date

2006-09-26T09:10:05-06:00

ID

80551

Comment

Ben Allen has written aviewpoint that highlights economic activity underway or on the drawing board in Jackson. Ben, thank you very much for getting the positive word out about the city. Meltonites and surburbanites may think Jackson is on the verge of collapse, but we know better. If anything, it's on the verge of rising to a level that we may not have ever seen before.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-26T09:24:59-06:00

ID

80552

Comment

It was a good list GEB! But, who keeps pushing the notion that Jackson is falling apart if not the Councilman himself? No one i know seems too worried about Jackson falling apart as much as we worry about the negative image Melton and his crack staff of supporters has brought upon us!

Author

pikersam

Date

2006-09-26T09:51:03-06:00

ID

80553

Comment

I know what you mean, Pike. I started in on that article, and thought, "good lord, what does Allen know about the state of the city that leads him to believe that it's 'collapsing'." Becuase the only person I've heard say anyting about 'collapse' is Allen. Pike + JFP 4EVA!!!

Author

kate

Date

2006-09-26T09:56:39-06:00

ID

80554

Comment

Remember Ben Allen's normal northeast Jackson Republican constituency that he sees on a regular basis, just living where he does. Many of them had already given up on Jackson and look at the "Melton mess" as just an excuse to further criticize the City. I've heard the same sort of stuff that the city is about to "explode" or "collapse" or whatever at cocktail party and golf course talk. Even Attorney General Hood has said publicly that he thinks the city has "hit bottom." So, perhaps we're talking semantics here and ought to be looking at substance. What has Ben been DOING and not SAYING. I suggest a lot. I, for one, appreciate Ben Allen's passion for the city (even if sometimes he seems a little hyper and too quick to talk before he thinks things through). There was a time that I doubted where he stood. Now, at least I know where his heart is. I'm glad he's president of the City Council now and can provide some leadership for the city, which is lacking in the mayor's office. Good job, Ben. Keep up the hard work.

Author

FriendsofJackson

Date

2006-09-26T10:25:18-06:00

ID

80555

Comment

Ben's column references favorible bond ratings provided to COJ by Moody's and S&P. The actual reports themselves would make for helpful reading.unfortunately the reports are onlyavailable to subsrcibers.i.e COJ and investment banks. Is it possible for JFP, or perhaps Ben, to post the ratings reports on the blog?

Author

chimneyville

Date

2006-09-26T11:24:41-06:00

ID

80556

Comment

Many of them had already given up on Jackson and look at the "Melton mess" as just an excuse to further criticize the City. I've heard the same sort of stuff that the city is about to "explode" or "collapse" or whatever at cocktail party and golf course talk. Indeed. We predicted his biggest North Jackson supporters would do that back during the campaign -- that is, once he melted down (which all indications were that he would), his Republican supporters would become fair-weather friends and turn against him. I'm still waiting for them to fill the airwaves with the fact that he's a "Democrat" -- which would be the most cynical, dishonest tactic, considering that he was financed mostly by Republicans. However, the Dems deserve a flogging on him, too. They were too timid to stand up against him during the campaign when he lied about residency, and even being a d Democrat. Johnson tried to, bu the part didn't get his back. So, per usual, both parties are responsible for the mess we're in. Even Attorney General Hood has said publicly that he thinks the city has "hit bottom." Careful on lifting him out of context on that statement.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-26T11:25:07-06:00

ID

80557

Comment

Todd, why is yuppie big box more acceptable than WalMart? Wouldn't IKEA undercut Article and Max's and OffiSource and EveryDay Gardener, and local frame shops and local hardware stores, in the same way that WalMart undercuts McDade's and Brent's? Sure, I think it's possible that IKEA would affect those businesses, but not in the same way as WalMart. First, I don't think IKEA would shop Article and Max and OffiSource and EveryDay Gardner and drop end-cap prices to undercut them. Also, I don't think IKEA would sell staples -- gas, milk, meat, whatever -- at loss-leader pricing in order to get people to also buy their furniture. (I doubt it would work...although the coffee danishes *are* yummy...mmmmm.... :-) It'd also argue that, by and large, you've got three different clienteles that shop IKEA, Article and OffiSource -- people shop Article are individuals who appreciate the *real thing*, people who shop OffiSource are corporate/business clients who appreciate the *real thing,* while people shop IKEA are careless latte-swilling yuppies who can't tell the real thing if it runs up and bites them on the ankle. (I include myself in that last category :-) Not that you aren't poking holes in my alt-big-box argument...I don't really know what the solution to that is. It seems to me that most non-urban stripmall development has a half-life of about 15 years (the mid-Lakeland businesses I see struggling along are an example, perhaps), while urban infill development that fails to take into account traditional urban metrics (in other words, if it's designed like a suburban stripmall) doesn't often fare much better. That said, I'm not certain IKEA makes the most sense...in the different locations I've seen, it's certainly a mixed bag as to whether they drive additional development. (In Houston I picture some small restaurants around that parking lot; in Atlanta, of course, there's the whole railyard development that IKEA is a part of.) Maybe Old Navy is the better choice. Maybe some idea hiding over here. It seems like some sort of development designed to encourage/incubate local businesses would be the best way to go...in fact, Matthew Dalby (formerly of JSU's urban planning dept) had shown me some great sketches a few years back for plans to create "town center"-type developments along the (oddly named) Metro Parkway to mitigate some of its suburban design metrics (e.g. to turn it into a residental avenue instead of a limited access highway). It seems like a good way to go would be a discount clothing retailer (I think of Filene's Basement in New York or Nordstrom Rack in the West) that anchors a ton of other local businesses.

Author

Todd Stauffer

Date

2006-09-26T12:49:45-06:00

ID

80558

Comment

"It'd also argue that," Every since I became the iTodd it looks like I've started talking about myself in the neuter third person. That's kinda scary.

Author

Todd Stauffer

Date

2006-09-26T12:51:16-06:00

ID

80559

Comment

I think Old Navy makes the most sense of all IF we're going the big-box route. Consider for a moment who they would hurt—and then who they would draw. Seems win-win on the surface. I'm with the iTodd on Wal-Mart. I don't see that the advantages would outweigh the problems, and the thought that they could destroy McDades there is heartbreaking to me.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-26T13:06:02-06:00

ID

80560

Comment

nice response, todd. I think the key is this part: Not that you aren't poking holes in my alt-big-box argument...I don't really know what the solution to that is. It seems to me that most non-urban stripmall development has a half-life of about 15 years (the mid-Lakeland businesses I see struggling along are an example, perhaps), while urban infill development that fails to take into account traditional urban metrics (in other words, if it's designed like a suburban stripmall) doesn't often fare much better. I do think that it's part corporate behavior (undercutting, loss leaders, etc), and part design, logistics, and transporation. Seems like bringing any sort of retail development to an urban environment would require a different set of criteria than for suburban. I'd like to see some developments take place in Jackson that don't assume that we all want to drive everywhere. Even Fondren would benefit massively from some additional crosswalks and traffic controls. Crossing streets on foot in Fondren is very scary most of the time. It's hard for me to argue that WalMart's decision to offer rock bottom prices on prescription drugs is necessarily "bad". Drugs are expensive, many people spend way too much money on them, and being able to get them cheap is a godsend for many. However, that doesn't make me a fan of WalMart, as a general concept. That said, I do think there needs to be a way to incorporate national retailers, without choking off local businesses. I'm just not sure how that would work, and I'm not sure that "yuppie" big box is any better in the long run than WalMart. Though, I'd love an Ikea in town, for sure.

Author

kate

Date

2006-09-26T13:08:51-06:00

ID

80561

Comment

Of course, I say that and then the thoughts of the small business owners who run the discount clothing stores come to mind. But it's hard to imagine that many of the same folks who would shop at an Old Navy aren't going anyway, just shlepping to County Line Road. People shop for clothes at different places—but food, gas, drugs, etc., tend to find one place and stick to it. And, of course, it was an Old Navy that helped Harlem's economic development—not a Wal-Mart that would shut down other grocery stores, etc. Just thinkin' out loud here.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-26T13:11:36-06:00

ID

80562

Comment

Yeah, I think ultimately the difference is that WalMart's whole business strategy is *cheap*. So, they tend to offer lots of stuff, for cheap, and therefore impact lots of other businesses. Old Navy offers *clothes* for cheap, and Ikea *furniture* for cheap, so their impact would be more limited. Don't underestimate the draw of WalMart for some people, though Donna. I know folks in NE Jackson who drive their big, gas guzzling vehicles out Lakeland once a week so they can do their shopping at WalMart.

Author

kate

Date

2006-09-26T13:24:22-06:00

ID

80563

Comment

I don't under-estimate its draw. That's why I don't want to see it run out the local businesses we do have in West Jackson. If we believe the answer there is big-box, then let's pick one that will (a) have large economic impact, while (b) not driving out all sorts of businesses that are selling basic necessities that people will then all buy at one place. That sounds counter-productive, although I certainly appreciate Pops' and Deuce's motivation on it. At least they're trying to change things, and that's a great start.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-09-26T13:34:03-06:00

ID

80564

Comment

Yeah, I think ultimately the difference is that WalMart's whole business strategy is *cheap*. So, they tend to offer lots of stuff, for cheap, and therefore impact lots of other businesses. Old Navy offers *clothes* for cheap, and Ikea *furniture* for cheap, so their impact would be more limited. Actually, WalMart's business strategy is *the appearance of cheap.* From what I've read, watched, heard, etc. (and I haven't been on an anti-WalMart tear in a year or so, so some of this might be out of date), is that WalMart finds ways to *suggest* that everything is cheap, when, in fact, they'll often price things higher than competitors as you walk further into the shelves. I'm sure you'd have to get down and dirty to find an example, but it'd be along the lines of a $2 FAMILY SIZE box of macaroni-and-cheese ($2.19 at the grocery store) on the end cap and $.79 for a can of lima beans instead of 2-for-$1 at the grocery store. That kinda thing. Cheap gas in the parking lot, but plastic garden chairs that you could get for a better price at Lowes. (Again...I haven't comparison-shopped WalMart -- God forbid -- but it's that sort of thing that made the FTC look into WalMart's "Always the Lowest Price" marketing in the 90s and so on.) On the prescription drug front, note that WalMart is negotiating low, volume pricing on *generic* drugs -- and common ones -- again pursuit of the perception that they have the lowest prices so that they get people's busy out of force of habit. (Heck, penicillin is only $5? That must mean that my Lipitor it cheap there, too. Why even price compare? I don't have time to go to Brent's, anyway? What? Brent's is out of business? When did that happen? It was such an institution.) And, no, I'm not saying that's necessarily "bad," -- I see it as esentially "amoral" that WalMart is doing that. However, if more people move their prescriptions from Brent's (or a local equivalent) to WalMart, then I see that as "bad" because I want Brent's to still be there because I like the veggie burger. In general, though, I'm of the mindset that the fewer WalMarts, the better -- not for WalMart, necessarily, but for local communities. In an urban setting I'd be even more cautious because the predatory nature of a WalMart coupled with it's one-stop-out-of-habit marketing formula could really hurt a variety of mom-and-pop businesses which, dollar-for-dollar sold, generate and re-invest considerably more in the local economy than *any* non-local big box.

Author

Todd Stauffer

Date

2006-09-26T13:41:41-06:00

ID

80565

Comment

Lots of retailers do the ole bait and switch. In fact, lots of times that gigantic box of laundry detergent (for example) is more expensive per ounce than the smaller. Simply because we're all used to the notion that "buying in bulk" makes things cheaper. I agree that the fewer WalMarts, the better. I've only been inside one on two occassions, and I swear I could feel my soul being sucked from my body. Just trying to figure out the whole contiuum of retailers, national or local, big box or otherwise.

Author

kate

Date

2006-09-26T13:50:54-06:00

ID

80566

Comment

Go big or go home.

Author

Kendrick Johnson

Date

2006-09-26T23:05:37-06:00

ID

80567

Comment

Ladd, what exactly do you want Mississippians to understand about the past in order for Jackson to move forward? I dont think I have ever seen anyone on this site say "thank God for slavery or it really wasnt that bad or I wish we could get more National Guardsmen down here with dogs to keep blacks away from the white water fountains or Hey!! We need stronger fire hoses." Why are you so set on this concept? I think everyone with a clue understands that blacks had a terrible past in Mississippi. What could I do to help people understand the past better?

Author

colby

Date

2006-09-27T11:21:47-06:00

ID

80568

Comment

ladd -- "We can't forget the race part. It's part of our history, and we won't solve problems by refusing to face the reasons they are there–including racism." Are you talking about reverse racism?

Author

colby

Date

2006-09-27T11:26:08-06:00

ID

80569

Comment

Yeah Colby, I'm sure she was talking about "reverse racism," whatever the hell that is. Hey Pike, Milwaukee does rock! Especially in the summer. The winters are another story altogether.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2006-09-27T12:04:23-06:00

ID

80570

Comment

I am sure that Robert E. Lee was a swell guy, just as I'm sure that Erwin Rommel was swell. If you fight for an evil cause, however, you give up your right to have buildings named after you. What about naming buildings after white folks who opposed secession? They did exist, though most of them weren't vocal about it, lest someone shoot them in the face. Southern honor, and all that. Of course, what would be really great would be to name a building after some of the slaves who actually built this state. I remember having a real epiphany the first time I visited Washington, D.C. On one side of the Potomac, you've got the Lincoln Memorial. On the other, you've got one of Lee's houses, which is now part of Arlington Cemetary. And then you have that highway running along the Potomac on the Virginia side, the Jefferson Davis Highway. If that ain't an extended middle finger, I don't know what is.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2006-09-27T12:14:03-06:00

ID

80571

Comment

Thanks Brian...I thought that was what she was talking about.

Author

colby

Date

2006-09-27T13:08:24-06:00

ID

80572

Comment

Has a developer been chosen for the Old Capitol Green project yet?

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-09-29T10:24:14-06:00

ID

80573

Comment

Ok, time to celebrate and add another plus for downtown Jackson. The Brunini law firm yesterday signed on with Parkway to be one of the anchor tenants in the new "Two Jackson Place" office tower to be built in downtown Jackson. The other anchor tenant is Watkins Ludlam. Kudos to BOTH law firms, to Steve Rogers of Parkway, to Ben Allen. Margaret Barrett-Simon and the host of other folks who worked so hard on this project.

Author

Pops

Date

2006-10-02T13:44:58-06:00

ID

80574

Comment

Full Spectrum Inc. of New York City, NY has been selected as the developer for the Old Capitol Green Project, and they are speculating that other private property owners in Downtown near the project may join in and develop on there properties.

Author

optimisticaboutNewJackCity

Date

2006-10-03T16:51:59-06:00

ID

80575

Comment

I figured Full Spectrum would be all but a shoo-in for the project. Seems like downtown and the city as a whole is now on a roll. Old Capitol Green and the King Edward restoration are underway; Two Jackson Place is about to get going and a heavy equipment company announced that they are moving from Pearl to south Jackson. Imagine that, a company moving from outside of Jackson into the city! And some say Jackson is a pariah.

Author

golden eagle

Date

2006-10-03T21:11:16-06:00

ID

80576

Comment

Wow... everyone just talks so much on here. I never read everything. I read most of the stuff about the "city vs burbs" and the arguments in them and I would just like to put my 2 cents in. I think that the city and the burbs have become just as vital to this area's growth. I don't believe suburbs would have happened without the invention of the car and the bulding of interstates. I think that now that they are here it is time to promote DIVERSE economic growth in all of these individual areas, while keeping a postive overall image of the metropolitan area. I never heard about this Wal-Mart on West Capitol, but my belief is that Jackson should be moving towards more mixed-use developments with slightly higher densities in population. I would like to see Wal-Mart do something NEW and vibrant when coming to the city. Perhaps something that has two stories, but I don't believe it should look anything like suburbia. I also think that it is time for this city to start promoting JPS. JPS has great programs which include IB and APAC. I will say that I don't understand someone who moves out of a city primarily for newly built house. Maybe it's just me but I find beauty in something that has character and won't look like everyone else's house on the street. I think Jackson is on it's way to growth, but this will not slow down the suburbs but help them to find their character and how they fit into this area. I would love to move to a new development if it looked like the historic homes of Mississippi, and that's what I find so sad about our society today. Everybody is concerned with the newest fad, and buying those cookie cutter house's in the burbs. All of them look the same to me. In fact Kingfish, I live in South Baton Rouge and I hate all the developments except for The Mall of Louisiana. I think it's time for midsize southern cities to step-it-up because in 10-20 years they will be large cities with metropolitan areas over 1 million. I heard the other day that UM hospital wanted to put a medical research park over the Veterans Memorial Stadium site, but it might not happen anytime soon because the state doesn't want to fund a new stadium for JSU. It's the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Taxes from a Medical Research park would surely pay off the stadium. What's sadder is that Jackson, Jackson State and UM hospital didn't do anything to move forward and find another source of funding. It's time for this state to start caring about its capital and not just its casinos. They have no problem sending money to Biloxi or Tunica, but when it comes to Jackson needs we are often overlooked or underfunded. If the state would get off their asses and promote growth from Tunica, to Jackson, to Biloxi each one of those areas would begin to grow and prosper along with everything in between them. Do I think it's a race issue? No. Do I think it's an issue of the lack of education and accountability in today's society? Certainly. I don't know how anyone feels about what I have said, but you can feel free to correct me if I am wrong on any of the facts.

Author

optimisticaboutNewJackCity

Date

2006-10-05T15:51:32-06:00

ID

80577

Comment

EMAIL FROM BEN ALL: please send this "pre-announcement" to all you have the time to [that are in your address book]....these efforts are an effort of "civic pride"...please be there...show your appreciation to these civic patriots who are fighting , in many instances , not only for "economic reasons", but also with pride in our CAPITOL CITY ...we are at the cutting edge of our future...the critical mass is now moving at "light speed"......the predictions we have been yelling about for 2 to 3 years are unfolding... be proud of your city...SHOW UP....[please]...and keep reading....the next few months will continue to reveal victory after victory.... i wish i were 25 again...so i could see all of this magic unfold.... ******************************************* Please mark your calendars for October 16th at 10 a.m. for the formal announcement and unveiling of the names, renderings, participants, and financing of the Jackson Place office/retail/residential/parking development and redevelopment. We hope to have a large crowd to support the good news of major professional firms recommitting themselves to our city. The Governor, Mayor, Council, Supervisors, civic and business leaders will be in attendance. A more formal invitation is forthcoming but I wanted you to have a personal invitation from me so you could plan your calendar accordingly. Thanks for all of your support for Parkway over the years and look forward to seeing you on the 16th! Steven G. Rogers President and CEO Parkway Properties, Inc.

Author

Pops

Date

2006-10-05T19:57:40-06:00

ID

80578

Comment

What the metro area could use is cheap office space. I've seen the prices for Colony Crossing and Dogwood. Ouch!

Author

Ironghost

Date

2006-10-05T20:04:57-06:00

ID

80579

Comment

so like, the new Walmart opened yesterday in Midtowne Atlanta near the Atlantic Station.....it has wooden floors and designer lighting and Ikea type stuff.......accessories.....Mayor Mary will be on this so quick.....

Author

ATLExile

Date

2006-10-18T11:25:26-06:00

ID

80580

Comment

Icky.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2006-10-18T11:36:59-06:00