Jackson Free Press

Audio of press conference: Lumumba_21207.mp3 (8.3MB)

Attorney Chokwe Lumumba, an oustpoken advocate for African American rights, held a press conference in his office today to denounce a visit by Mayor Frank Melton, former bodyguards Michael Recio and Marcus Wright, and at least 20 police officers to the Upper Level Nightclub between 1:30 and 2 a.m. Sunday morning, as reported that day by the Jackson Free Press. Lumumba told the press that he and others—including attorney Sharon Gipson, ACLU Director Nsombi Lambright and NAACP President Derrick Johnson—were gathered to "deliver an urgent message of outrage" because the "Jackson Gestapo have hit again."

He said that the Melton entourage issued no tickets, or found any violations, but closed the club that night anyway, with Melton himself yelling out, "Shut the mother f*cker down!" He said he believes that Melton is targeting the Upper Level to make white business owners who supported his campaign happy—people who are "uncomfortable" with a black club in that area.

Lumumba said the mayor was there with a fire marshall, who later told WAPT's Greg Flynn that he had been called to the club, but would not say by whom. The attorneys maintain that the entourage did not take a head count in the club to determine whether it was over-capacity before Melton declared that it would be shut down. "The mayor is running amok," Lumumba said. He added that the mayor is "not showing any kind of position of leadership ... this kind of behavior has to stop."

Those gathered seemed particularly concerned about what they call "profiling" of African American citizens—by an African American mayor. Lumumba said the community would not tolerate such behavior in former Mayors Danks and Ditto—both white—and was not going to tolerate it in a "chocolate-colored administration," either. They are organizing in response to Melton's tactics, said Lumumba, who founded the Malcolm X Center in Jackson in 1991 as a way to organize and train young activists. Lumumba is often called "the people's lawyer" due to his outspoken, and often controversial, lawyering on behalf of African Americans.

He said Melton is violating the same law he's accusing others of violating (the curfew). He said Melton thinks he's "God," and is leading "charades in blackface" when he proclaims that, "I'm the black mayor working for the community." Chokwe said: "He's not working for the interest of the community."

Sharon Gipson said that witnesses saw Police Chief Shirlene Anderson there, but that she stayed close to the vehicles. Chokwe said Melton was wearing some kind of badge around his neck.

When asked by the Jackson Free Press how he would respond to people who say that challenging Melton's crime-fighting methods is a witchhunt on someone who is trying to protect black communities, Lumumba responded: "We know a little bit about fighting witchhunts. I'm saying that Frank Melton is violating our people's rights ... (and) needs to be answerable to the community and at the ballot box."

Lumumba said he believes this latest incident will encourage Chancery Judge William Singletary to move faster on the Upper Level's motion for a restraining order against Melton and his entourage, filed after numerous visits by the mayor since he took office. The last time the mayor went to the Upper Level, witnesses say that his bodyguards handcuffed club manager Tonari Moore because he was videotaping them. Then, outside, a group of young men jumped off the Mobile Command Center and attacked Moore while in handcuffs, they say.

More details as they develop ...

Previous Comments

ID

125343

Comment

Here's The Clarion-Ledger's version of this story. Note that, at least at the moment, they are mispelling his name as "Lamumba" throughout the story. I heard reporter Baydala asking him for a card afterward; she seemed to have no idea who he is. Otherwise, it's remarkable what she didn't put in there.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T17:02:04-06:00

ID

125344

Comment

My sources are telling me Frank and bodyquards were playing the Oscar winning record "It's Hard Out Here On A Pimp" as they approached and left the Upper Deck. This leads me to believe they were on a mission to do something earth-shattering or attention-grabbing. Don't rely on my sources though. They're often wrong.

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-12T17:38:28-06:00

ID

125345

Comment

"It's har out here for a pimp, when you're trying to get the money for the rent, because a whole lot of _______ is jumping ship.

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-12T17:45:57-06:00

ID

125346

Comment

Ray, I've already been singing that song all day. Are you reading my mind!?!

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T17:46:55-06:00

ID

125347

Comment

Seems so appropriate for the occasion. Like minds think alike!

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-12T17:52:28-06:00

ID

125348

Comment

"He said he believes that Melton is targeting the Upper Level to make white business owners who supported his campaign happy—people who are "uncomfortable" with a black club in that area." Were there any facts supporting this accusation given?

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-12T17:56:09-06:00

ID

125349

Comment

No. Obviously, it was his opinion.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T18:10:01-06:00

ID

125350

Comment

Okay, opinion uninformed by facts. Just checking.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-12T18:41:18-06:00

ID

125351

Comment

Not sure of your point, Niles. Many quotes from sources are their opinions, and it's not as if Chokwe is the first person who came up with the idea that many of Mr. Melton's actions are to appease his conservative white supporters. Come on. He was elected on "thug" rhetoric. Think it through.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T18:42:49-06:00

ID

125352

Comment

I've got a huge problem with WAPT's poll about the Upper Lounge. Go to their home page. The Question is: Do you think Mayor Melton's recent shutdown of the Upper Level nightclub is going too far? Yes, he violated his probation No, this is what it takes Ummm.... Takes to do what? Was there something wrong with those students going to a club? No one has been killed outside the club in two years. So, what are you trying to say WAPT? The station is alluding that Melton is doing "what it takes" to fight crime by shutting down a club where young adults hang out and party. You are not helping the problem WAPT when you pull crap like this.

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-12T19:10:59-06:00

ID

125353

Comment

The video of "no comment" anderson running from Greg Flynn whn asked about The Upper Level incident is priceless. She must have been wearing Nikes! She had those babies in high gear. :-) Watch it tonite on WAPT @10:00 pm.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-12T19:11:40-06:00

ID

125354

Comment

That was a good piece. I just saw it. Beyond it showing that the chief, once again, seems clueless, he got the probation guy on the record that Melton did not get permission to be out past his curfew, although note that former Melton campaign manager Robert Johnson, who is over Probation Services, had no comment. Good work, WAPT.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T19:13:58-06:00

ID

125355

Comment

Someone needs to hold the chief accountable on why she is wasting taxpayer money by allowing Recio and Wright to be Melton's personal assistants as they're being paid as detectives. That's more sheer absurdity. This little group goes everywhere together, usually in the middle of the night. What a mess.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-12T19:15:30-06:00

ID

125356

Comment

Pike-loves-the-JFP: "No, this is what it takes Ummm.... Takes to do what? Was there something wrong with those students going to a club? No one has been killed outside the club in two years. So, what are you trying to say WAPT?" No one has been killed outside the club in 2 years... Ever since I read that statement, I've been thinking and re-thinking... and then I thought some more... But I still keep coming to the same conclusion, Pike. No one has been killed outside the club in 2 years... 2 years. What's so sad, is that many of you, up to this point, probably have no idea why I'm perturbed about that statement. Well, let's unveil the mystery: "No one has been killed outside the club in 2 years..." Is life so meaningless today that we can make statements like, "Well, nobody's gotten killed over there in a few years", and just be ok with that? Society really has lost it... However, on another more upbeat (as upbeat as it can be, coming off my last few statements) topic... Hey, Ms. Ladd, it's nice to finally have an opportunity to say that I love your writing... How is everything?

Author

Jamar Muhammad

Date

2007-02-12T20:00:48-06:00

ID

125357

Comment

Chokwe Lumumba: "Campaign promises that should have never been made...." That one qoute nails this so called "administration". "Charades in Black face..." That was a good one too.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-12T20:03:25-06:00

ID

125358

Comment

You guys and gals should listen to this.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-12T20:05:08-06:00

ID

125359

Comment

Sorry about that Jamal. I wasn't trying to trivialize the situation. I was using that quip to sum up that it is just a club of people having a good time with little incident since that woman was shot a couple of years ago. Even Hal and Mals, and the sorts, have had their troubles over the years; but, you don't see Melton leading posses of police to terrorize the patrons.

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-12T20:46:00-06:00

ID

125360

Comment

The fact that Melton is out past his bedtime (again) without permission (again) to terrorize the Upper Level (again) isn't surprising. I just wish Mr Lumumba would tone it down and concentrate on the enemy, not irritating everyone else around there. The comments about surrounding businesses is his opinion, unless the JFP, CL, WAPT or someone has evidence. Frankie-boy won't face a minute of justice (again).

Author

Ironghost

Date

2007-02-12T21:23:25-06:00

ID

125361

Comment

"He operates 'outside the box'..." You show Franklin some RESPECT!

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-12T21:34:42-06:00

ID

125362

Comment

I did think it through, thanks for the tip Ms. Ladd. My conclusion is the same. Opinion without fact, especially racially charged opinion without fact, adds nil to the debate. The echo chamber here notwithstanding your paper is not normally known for throwing baseless opinion about race as accepted fact. Basically this thread, as Mr. Lumumba is doing is engaging in the time honored tradition of calling Mr. Melton an "uncle tom." I don't believe that is the case. I think, at the very least, Melton's prior history with upper level and its owner is far more likely an explanation than racism. So again, show me the facts, if you or Mr. Lumumba have them. Otherwise that comment about white business owners is pure inflammatory drivel.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-12T21:38:19-06:00

ID

125363

Comment

Also, while you are busy casting before the swine, what is the significance of the song from Hustle and Flow? The entire base thug nature of this administration offends and annoys me almost as much as the shrill hysterics of its opponents. I "gasp" almost wish I had voted for Johnson.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-12T21:45:36-06:00

ID

125364

Comment

I just listened to the audio of Chokwe Lumumba's press conference. I can't help but feel that, finally, Frank Melton may have met his match.

Author

Kacy

Date

2007-02-12T22:01:07-06:00

ID

125365

Comment

Good grief, the man just had heart surgery. If nothing else, he shouldn't be out doing stuff like this (for his health). He shouldn't be doing stuff like this anyway, especially not while on probation. Amazing, scary, wild.

Author

C.W.

Date

2007-02-12T22:07:05-06:00

ID

125366

Comment

met his match? You mean in terms of losing his temper? You are probably right. I'm not a fan of night club harrassment by the cops. I didn't like it when they did it to the Dock or other nightclubs in Madison County and don't like it when they do it here. Having said that, there is a difference between harrassment and recognizing that more problems happen at nightclubs. Lets be real here. More fights occur at night clubs, exhibitions of public drunkeness, drug deals, and other forms of criminal behavior than at the mall or grocery store per se. Its one thing to allow nightclubs to operate lawfully and react to police calls from the establishment or have a patrol car or two nearby watching the road for drunk drivers. Its different to harass the owners and patrons if no crime is being committed.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-12T22:34:11-06:00

ID

125367

Comment

It is an easy problem to solve- just hire off-duty JPD officers to provide "security". I bet they wouldn't be raided anymore...

Author

Rico

Date

2007-02-12T22:43:10-06:00

ID

125368

Comment

not every club does that. some can't be bothered. Then there are those that stop their security at the door and all kinds of crap happens in the parking lot. Very few clubs hire security to work outside and in the parking lot.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-12T22:45:43-06:00

ID

125369

Comment

I wasn't really talking about the security aspect. I don't know how it works in Jackson, but in some cities the police officers can supplement their income in a very large way by providing "security" in their off duty hours. They are paid an outrageous sum of money to sit around on a bar stool for 6-8 hours whether they are actually needed or not. As long as the club owner continues to employ these guys, they *never* have any trouble with raids and such. But if they refuse the club becomes a "target". It is kind of a legal form of extortion...

Author

Rico

Date

2007-02-12T23:09:59-06:00

ID

125370

Comment

Well, before he violated his parole entering the upper level, His Mayor Frank was violating his parole by attending a private party for the rodeo where booze was flowing freely,,,, including an argument where there was an issue of (gasp) a white woman *drunken redheaded girl*(no race issues presented, just causing some of Franks supporters to question his race conscience approach) arguing with Rico ...."I asked the Mayor to dance, not some hired bitc!" Let's add up the violations. At a place where alcohol is being served, out past cerfiew, being in the company of known and accussed felons... I really wish judges would be this lenient with my clients. They go to jail for violations. Frank gets warning after warning after warning..

Author

AGamm627

Date

2007-02-13T00:53:31-06:00

ID

125371

Comment

Just listened to the press conference, and wow. Yes. It's good to see Chokwe Lumumba back on the scene... Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T01:34:29-06:00

ID

125372

Comment

"As long as the club owner continues to employ these guys, they *never* have any trouble with raids and such. But if they refuse the club becomes a "target"." - Rico That didn't stop Melton and his crew from raiding Jack & Jill's, gathering tag numbers, and looking through people's cars with their flashlights.

Author

kaust

Date

2007-02-13T08:42:29-06:00

ID

125373

Comment

Well, maybe it doesn't work the same way here. J&J's used off-duty JPD?

Author

Rico

Date

2007-02-13T08:57:53-06:00

ID

125374

Comment

Just a statement. I realize that we are having a go because he violated his probation (whatever he says) but what really sticks out to me is that Mighty Melton (you know kind of like Mighty Mouse with ears and all - I digress) is more worried about this club than the crime in other places of Jackson. Just last week we were broken into and the police came gave us a card -more like a calling card than anything - and said to call them if anything else happened. What the hell is all that about? The point is, Jackson doesn't have enough police to safe-guard the neighborhoods but on the other hand we have enough police to give Melton his own assistants/ admins/ guards/ concubines (or whatever those two are called) and enough police to raid a bar on a Sunday evening for a personal grudge? Surely they could have been other places preventing real crime.

Author

Puck

Date

2007-02-13T09:17:34-06:00

ID

125375

Comment

Mighty Melton (you know kind of like Mighty Mouse with ears and all - I digress) That's what Marshall's caractures of him remind me of! I couldn't place it. It fits, too. As for the cards, it's all you'll ever get out of JPD.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2007-02-13T09:37:31-06:00

ID

125376

Comment

Speaking of crime victims... Did any of you read about "Chief" anderson's "plan" she threw on the city council? Seems her "plan" includes charging crime victims $15.00 to take a report. C-L Story The problem I see is poor people will have to forgo this, while the rich can report their problems to police. Great. This "administration" is responsible for the increase in crime, and now they're going to charge us for it.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-13T09:42:18-06:00

ID

125377

Comment

Oh, gosh, this is mind-numbingly stupid. Do police ever charge for incident reports? I don't see how this could be any more Fourteenth Amendment-friendly than a poll tax. And raising fines from $25 to $100 only works if you're actually collecting the fines... Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T09:50:17-06:00

ID

125378

Comment

Why should anyone have to pay to report a crime? Is she insane? Here's another random thought - you know how Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger forgoes his salary (since he can) and has it go to the good of the state? Why can't Melton do this and hire some extra police? I'm all about random today...

Author

Puck

Date

2007-02-13T09:53:41-06:00

ID

125379

Comment

You mean JPD would actually fill out the forms finally? Wow! Still, it's not very 14th friendly, like Tom mentioned.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2007-02-13T09:59:35-06:00

ID

125380

Comment

Increasing the cost of accident reports from $25 to $35 and charging crime victims $15 for incident reports. from the Ledge That is absolutely the stupidest most anti-citizen idea I have ever heard. Poll tax is what popped into my mind before I read Tom's post. I can see it now. "Hey, lady I need $15.00 before I can write you a report on your house being robbed." Or..."I know you just got mugged; but, if you don't have $15.00 we can't go after this guy." Also, I doubt it would take a week before some officers are telling people it's $25.00 for the report, and pocketing the change. You can tell why her and mayor get along so well. It's like "Ren and Stimpy," only not so funny. So other cities do this? It's already bad enough the victim of a wreck can't get an accident report without paying.

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-13T10:13:56-06:00

ID

125381

Comment

Looks like they have a fee in the county where Richmond, VA is located. However, it is not clear from the wording if the victim gets an incident report for free or not? Notice they charge a considerable amount less for accident reports, and other services than Jackson.

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-13T10:23:06-06:00

ID

125382

Comment

why not? If your car gets stolen and recovered you have to pay to get it back. Spread the pain around some.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-13T10:25:52-06:00

ID

125383

Comment

And here's an example where it appears the fee was used to keep a journalist from getting reports for a story they were doing.

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-13T10:27:10-06:00

ID

125384

Comment

Maybe they can put the reports online for free since we've spent so much on that wonderful new website! ;-) I realize paper is expensive and we're such a eco-friendly city.... Maybe she's just trying to do her part for Mother Earth. The rural area outside Jackson never looked so promising!

Author

kaust

Date

2007-02-13T10:51:09-06:00

ID

125385

Comment

The city soon won't be able to afford the bandwith.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-13T11:01:05-06:00

ID

125386

Comment

Also, while you are busy casting before the swine, what is the significance of the song from Hustle and Flow? Actually, my basis for humming it all day yesterday was a cat joke Todd and I made about our little Deuce who we bring to work every day. We were sitting in front of Backyard Burger as I recall, making a joke about him coming to work every day. Then one of us said something about it being "hard out here for a kitty" or some such silly joke. Since then, I was humming the song all day; then Ray mentioned it. Thanks for asking, though. Niles, do you understand that most quotes used in journalism are simply statements of someone's opinion? In fact, most "news" articles in the MSM are long strings of statements of opinion with little fact or context to glue it all together. In this case, both Lumumba clearly stated this as opinion (as you can hear in the audio), and we presented it as such. There is nothing wrong with doing that. It is similar to quoting Stephanie Parker-Weaver talking about how Melton is a man of the people who is being persecuted, blah, blah (and, in fact, a balance to those statements, whether you agree with either one). There is nothing wrong with quoting such a statement of opinion. There will be some people who read it and believe it, and others will not. Still others can challenge it, but attacking the very fact that the opinion is shared is a waste of energy. The problem would be if he was stating that as hard fact, and then we presented it as hard fact (kind of like when Melton used the false drop-out figure during his campaign and the Ledger didn't correct it in the text.) Statements of fact are very different than statements of opinion, legally and otherwise. It continually amazes me that people don't understand the difference.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T11:01:42-06:00

ID

125387

Comment

If she really does want to charge for an incident report, that is certainly creating a barrier to discourage people from reporting crimes. Considering that she had dropped ComStat, presumably because she fears it shows how bad a job she is doing as chief, it isn't a stretch to imagine that she would want to anything possible to keep more crimes from being reported. The chief's primary goal seems to be covering her, and Melton's, asses. Of course, that was very likely why she was hired. (That was opinion, too, Niles.)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T11:11:16-06:00

ID

125388

Comment

Fish writes: Spread the pain around some. What a campaign slogan! "Melton '09: Spread the Pain Around Some"... Donna writes: If she really does want to charge for an incident report, that is certainly creating a barrier to discourage people from reporting crimes. Considering that she had dropped ComStat, presumably because she fears it shows how bad a job she is doing as chief, it isn't a stretch to imagine that she would want to anything possible to keep more crimes from being reported. Agreed, and this is exactly the kind of thing Stokes and Tisdale would have raised hell about before they decided to bow down to the suburban white agenda. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T11:24:23-06:00

ID

125389

Comment

So, it is intriguing that probation officer Grant told WAPT that Melton did not have permission and then had no comment by the time the Ledger got to him. Why didn't the Ledger quote what he told WAPT so that people know that two stories are being told??? Their story today (which spells Lumumba's name right this time): Jackson Mayor Frank Melton said he did not violate conditions of his probation or his bond while inspecting the Upper Level Bar and Grill and some other nightclubs this past weekend. "I had permission," Melton said, maintaining he had notified his probation officer he would be out past his midnight curfew. Melton is on probation after pleading no contest in November to a charge of carrying a gun on a school campus and guilty to two other misdemeanor gun charges. The mayor also is out on bond for five felony charges stemming from allegations he and his bodyguards and some men under his direction damaged a duplex in northwest Jackson with sledgehammers. His bond conditions prohibit him from carrying a gun or using police equipment for personal reasons. Neither Hinds County Circuit Judge Tomie Green, who oversees Melton's probation, nor special Judge Joe Webster, who oversees the mayor's bond, returned calls for comment. Dennis Grant of Probation Services Co., who monitors Melton's probation, would not comment on whether the mayor had permission to be out. "I report to the court," he said. OK, folks, the question is getting large now: Remember that Melton's campaign manager, Robert Johnson, is over Probation Services. Is it possible that he's telling Grant what to say? (He hasn't returned our calls, yet, but we'll keep trying.)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T11:25:22-06:00

ID

125390

Comment

Tom wrote: "Agreed, and this is exactly the kind of thing Stokes and Tisdale would have raised hell about before they decided to bow down to the suburban white agenda." What is the suburban white agenda?

Author

LawClerk

Date

2007-02-13T11:29:42-06:00

ID

125391

Comment

LawClerk, that's the $64,000 question, ain't it? But I probably should have said suburban-ist white agenda. Nothing against suburban whites. Technically speaking, I was one myself for two years. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T11:40:59-06:00

ID

125392

Comment

Well, if you find the answer, I need the $64,000! I don't get the suburban/urban/rural labels.

Author

LawClerk

Date

2007-02-13T11:47:12-06:00

ID

125393

Comment

I don't get the suburban/urban/rural labels. Unfortunately, too many do, and work every day to make sure that those stereotypes are true. Otherwise, I agree with Tom that Stokes and Tisdale's devotion to Melton is remarkable. I'll never forget Tisdale's column recently trying to draw the connection between Johnson and Leland Speed—instead of Melton and Speed. Either he thinks his readers are stupid, or he is woefully unaware of what is really going on in Melton circles. Of course, I have not let go of the idea that Melton is playing both naive white conservatives and the Advocate-Stokes-Parker-Weaver contingent to help his own personal agenda, whatever the hell that is. Or, he has them all indebted to him in some way, and they can't speak up.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:09:58-06:00

ID

125394

Comment

Also, if there is anybody in this city who I don't believe could or would be sucked into a game by Melton, it is Chokwe Lumumba. Like him or not, he has the power to balance a lot of the bizarre "Melton working for the people" propaganda put out by the Advocate folks. And, boy, did he do that in his press conference yesterday. If there is an attempt, as some claim, to taint the jury pool by trying to make "the people" think that Melton is on their side by tearing down Sutton's duplex, the best person in the city to get people think twice about that is very likely Lumumba. Melton supporters should not under-estimate him. He's come straight out and tell people that Melton is playing them for fools.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:12:46-06:00

ID

125395

Comment

Ladd, I think it's a fear thing. I really do. I know that some people, if not for the fear aspect of the Mayor, would speak up. And by the way, Lumumba is not the first person to stand up to Melton. And I can almost guarantee that Melton will back down... Just like he did the first time.

Author

LawClerk

Date

2007-02-13T12:14:46-06:00

ID

125396

Comment

Agreed. And having the NAACP and ACLU standing behind him made it that much more powerful. LawClerk, if you look at the history of white flight, you will find a clear white exurban movement within it--made up of people who think cities became too high-crime after integration, and are heading downhill. These folks support suburbs and suburban enterprises, and there's nothing wrong with that except that the suburbs tend to be disproportionately white and disproportionately high-income, and white flight creates a city that is increasingly non-white and low-income, so it is in effect a resegregation movement whether that is the intent or not. I think that what Stokes and Tisdale have in common with the exurbanites (I will find a good word for this one day) is that they also want to see white suburbs and a black city. You can see some evidence of this in the rhetoric Stokes used when he opposed annexation initiatives--he didn't want too many whites within the city limits, because that would dilute the power of black voters. I can see this point of view to a certain extent; if the entire tri-county area were annexed into Jackson, we would be living under a conservative white Republican administration that would almost certainly not be looking out for the interests of Jackson's black communities. It is not unreasonable to carry this line of reasoning further--I can see why someone might believe that the more black Jackson becomes, the less isolated the urban elite will be from the needs of Jackson's black communities and the less beholden politicians will be to white donors who most likely will not have the needs of Jackson's black citizens at heart. But as the distinction between Harvey Johnson and Frank Melton shows, an integrated city government actually does a much better job of looking out for black Jacksonians than a government that appeals to non-integrationists on both sides. We really need a "black-white coalition." That's the only way the city can move forward. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T12:25:11-06:00

ID

125397

Comment

And by the way, Lumumba is not the first person to stand up to Melton. You don't think *I* know that?!? ;-) The point is that Lumumba's voice is probably the strongest way to reach some of the Advocate's followers with a different message than the one Tisdale, Parker-Weaver and HIckingbottom are hawking. (Note they all receive money in one way or another from Melton and/or the city—either a paycheck or advertising.) This will provide a balance in rhetoric, and unfortunately sometimes that is the only way to tone down harmful rhetoric.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:25:30-06:00

ID

125398

Comment

I think that what Stokes and Tisdale have in common with the exurbanites (I will find a good word for this one day) is that they also want to see white suburbs and a black city. Well, sure. It's not like they hide it. Why do you think that Melton was against the King Edward and other diverse downtown development projects? Because the Advocate doesn't want anything done by a "brown society." I agree with concerns about the white developers who fled now coming in and taking over redevelopment now that it's happening and displacing homes and businesses of color. (Harvey Johnson was worried about that, too, even as he wasn't against diverse projects.) That's happened in lots of places, and is a very real concern. However, it makes no sense then for the Advocate folks to then turn around and support a mayor who is propped up by the very developers who fled the city. Unless, of course, they have all decided to be "separate but powerful" or some such bullsh!t. A conspiracy theorist could say that they have decided together to ruin "brown society" efforts to rebuild the city, then Tisdale et al can have the city, and the developers can build towers in the 'burbs. I'm not that extreme of a conspiracy nut, but I know some people believe some version of this. And in some ways, it would be the only way some of these weird coalitions make sense. Kind of like the Advocate of the 1960s cooperating with white supremacists to help keep things separate. Meantime, the really crazy part is that, had we not come along with a diverse readership willing to talk about this stuff, how many people would actually realize that Melton said one thing to white conservative voters and the opposite to black hip-hoppers. It wasn't like the Northside Sun, or the Jackson Advocate, or the Ledger, or the TV stations were going to reveal this bizarre strategy. I remember trying to get white Jacksonians to believe that Stokes was in Melton's camp during the campaign. Somehow, they had convinced themselves that Melton would be against Stokes et al. Now, we've ended up with a bizarre fear coalition with Stokes and Allen side by side propping Melton up. Who'da thunk?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:33:32-06:00

ID

125399

Comment

And having the NAACP and ACLU standing behind him made it that much more powerful. On that point, one of the most disgusting things I've seen come out of the Advocate camp are efforts to bash and discredit the young African Americans heading those groups and challenging a mayor who is profiling poor, black neighborhoods (or certain ones). Is this what the Movement was really about? I don't believe it.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:38:25-06:00

ID

125400

Comment

"I don't give a sh!t what those people think..."

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-13T12:44:26-06:00

ID

125401

Comment

Right. He's not a big fan of what he calls "ethnic" groups. Unless he's speaking to them, of course. Or needs them. Schizoid, eh?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T12:54:09-06:00

ID

125402

Comment

Did any of you read about "Chief" anderson's "plan" she threw on the city council? Seems her "plan" includes charging crime victims $15.00 to take a report. Is it just me, or did anyone else read this as Anderson calling for a $15 charge to get a *copy* of an incident report (for insurance reporting, etc.) not for actually taking down a report when an incident occurs? (What would that be...cash to the cop when the car arrives? Something added to your water bill? :-) Charging for a copy of the report seems to make more sense in this context, right? (Not that it's necessarily a good idea...)

Author

Todd Stauffer

Date

2007-02-13T13:28:27-06:00

ID

125403

Comment

"how many people would actually realize that Melton said one thing to white conservative voters and the opposite to black hip-hoppers. " ..Ive been following but not planning on interjecting much, however, I can say that during the campaign ALL 3 candidates one thing to the white conservatives and another to the "black hiphoppers" (what was that?) MAP attended other events by Johnson and Whitlow and heard firs hand them saying things directly different than what they told us at the Birdland..Either that or they conveniently left out info when they spoke to us...Point is..it's not just one particular person..it's a POLITICIAN thing. If you think in this day and age you're gonna find one that keeps the same agenda and says the same thing in front of all groups and organizations you're misled. POLITICIANS speeches are always geared to their audience. name one whose aren't

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T13:34:08-06:00

ID

125404

Comment

I thought that might be what it is—but should a taxpayer/crime victim be forced to pay *$15* for a copy of their own crime report!?!

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T13:34:52-06:00

ID

125405

Comment

No, Kaze, not to the extreme I'm talking about. I was at the Bravo! ladies breakfast, and I have a video of Melton's MAP visit. We're not talking normal politician disparities here, I promise. While on the topic, I cannot, and could not, believe the extend that Melton condescended to y'all at the MAP event. I've never anything quite like it (at least from someone claiming to be your friend).

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T13:37:26-06:00

ID

125406

Comment

"Increasing the cost of accident reports from $25 to $35 and charging crime victims $15 for incident reports". That's verbatim. If you are a victim of crime that involves property, your insuance company will want a copy of the report.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-13T13:37:30-06:00

ID

125407

Comment

I can see it now.... Cop:"Yeah... you got held up? No sh!t! Well, anyway I know you just got your purse snatched, but Shirlene said she needs to hold fifteen...." Crime Fighting My Aching A$$.

Author

Cliff Cargill

Date

2007-02-13T13:41:48-06:00

ID

125408

Comment

now Donna I was there...I moderated ALL of the candidates appearances and truth be told, Im wondering how you can say he was condescending when *I* didnt feel like it. And I don't really recall anyone outside of Skipp feeling like their questions were'nt answered and as you saw(since you have the footage) a lot of folks had questions. In actuality, it was Johnson who ended up being a little condescending by the end of his visit. He was visibly agitated by some of the questions and generally unconfortable...And I was THERE so I can say...I speak nothing but the truth..so no need to feel like you're offended FOR us everyone there was grown and got the chance to speak. We were cool. in fact, you want to talk about disparity in speeches. When we attended a Johnson function the next week in which MAP board members were invited to, Johnson talked about erecting cameras in the projects and on certain streets. A point in which he "left out" when he spoke to us. And I wasnt the only one who caught that. Again...ITS POLITICIANS! so Im never amazed

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T13:49:34-06:00

ID

125409

Comment

Dear God this city is in a world of hurt. We are almost to the point of no return...And nothing that the city government has a finger in is getting better, or getting accomplished.

Author

colby

Date

2007-02-13T14:08:22-06:00

ID

125410

Comment

Donna writes: However, it makes no sense then for the Advocate folks to then turn around and support a mayor who is propped up by the very developers who fled the city. Unless, of course, they have all decided to be "separate but powerful" or some such bullsh!t. Well, it's not really all bullshit. I mean, in their defense... ...okay, I'm getting a little emotional here, and I hope nobody takes this too hard, but I'm starting to see some things differently, even over the past few hours... ...when have the majority of whites in this metro area ever looked out for the interests of black Jacksonians? Ever? At any time? Even the ones who give lip service to the idea? I mean, in Madison we have dumb regulations like a three-month prison sentence for parking on the curb that I think are obviously designed to keep low-income blacks out of the city. The school bond vote is the first example I can think of that shows the situation has changed, but I doubt even most of those folks would support redirecting funds from Ole Miss to JSU or somesuch, and if the suburbanites were included in the vote, I'm pretty sure the bond would never have even passed. And even now, I'm hearing crime is up, crime is up, crime is up, so much worse than it was even during the crack years--well, fuck that, it's not. It's still down over 15 years ago, but the difference is that it's spreading into white neighborhoods where people don't think it belongs. The district map tells the story. Bennie Thompson represents west Jackson. Who represents me? Chip fucking Pickering. My view has changed a lot thanks to the wonderful influence of a few badass but incredibly patient activists of color. I get it now. I understand Black Power. I understand blue-eyed devil. I am one when I'm not careful. I understand all whites participate in institutional racism and most whites have demonstrated that they are perfectly willing to let people die to keep it that way. So I can relate to Stokes' motives now where I couldn't a few months ago because I know the history has been that FUBU is the only way you can survive in this state. The situation is changing, but if Tisdale and Stokes don't want my white ass anywhere near them, I can understand that. I don't like it, I think it comes from a view of the world that is obsolete and will have to be replaced, but I get it. And the truth is that I agree to the extent that I wouldn't want to see us annex the entire tri-county area, and the fact that there would be a white majority ignoring the inner-city is exactly the reason why. I am an integrationist, but I believe that true integration requires a peer relationship, so I understand Black Power. I think this is probably why good people, like Bill Chandler and James Evans and Wydett Hawkins, supported Frank Melton. I can't say for sure; I haven't asked Bill or James about it. But I see a line of reasoning there that I can relate to. I don't agree with it, but who would expect my white Ward 7 ass to agree with it? The deep irony of all this, though, is that Melton is not about Black Power. He's playing both sides. He might fire white officials and replace them with black youth and call that Black Power, but as long as he dehumanizes the black community in this city with the raids and the beatings and the KKK comparisons and so forth, he's just Bull Connor with a black face. I can't say that because nobody will or should believe it coming from a white man, but Chokwe Lumumba represents the interests of the community in a way I'll never be able to, and he's standing up to this whole mess, God bless him. This is the first time I think Melton has really been put on notice--all the AG stuff, all the DA stuff, can't really hurt him if he has the support of the community. But he's losing the support of the community. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T14:18:00-06:00

ID

125411

Comment

I'm not feeling offended *for* you; I'm offended, period, by the ways Melton talked to different people. I hate the way he spreads stereotypes about the hip-hop community to older groups, black and white, for instance—making it sound like the key to ending thuggery is for y'all to get those earrings out of your ears, give 'em to your sisters, and pull your pants up on your a$$es, for instance. As for the MAP meeting, I keep saying we're going to put the video up, but it has to be converted or some such. Clearly, there were more people than Skipp frustrated with Melton's refusal to answer direct, intelligent questions -- and his repeated response of "I'm going to build you a recording studio, son. You deserve it," to questions that had nothing to do with a recording studio. I'm not saying that Johnson was comfortable -- funny how discussions of Melton revert to being comparisons with a former mayor, thus avoiding the issue -- what I'm saying is that Melton was downright offensive, especially in comparison with the way he then goes out and dogs y'all in front of other groups. What what the craziest was how he made himself sound like such a man of the streets in Jackson -- to y'all. That sure wasn't his schtick in front of the Republican ladies at Bravo. Also, if you hadn't noticed, Johnson is not in office or under indictment for getting young people to commit crimes. Can we have a conversation about Melton on his own merits, or lack thereof, for once, Kaze? You also might consider coming by the office and watching the tape with me at some point. Now that you've had some distance, and seen that Melton isn't everything he promised, you might see how he really came off that night. And as I've said to many people, there is no shame in believing in someone who turns out to be something different than he pretended to be.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T14:25:37-06:00

ID

125412

Comment

BTW, Kaze, while we have you hear: What do you think about the tarring and feathering of Evans Welch, a diagnosed schrizophrenic from a poor family in Jackson who has been arrested only for petty drug possession? Are you concerned about his rights? And what do you say about Melton's repeated visits to the Upper Level, and the reports that young men on the Command Center jumping off and beating up the manager while in handcuffs? What do you think of the treatment of Michael Black -- and Melton calling him a "damn thug" when saying that they weren't going to fire police officers who beat him up while in handcuffs? Where does all that fit into his "outreach" to youth who need it?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T14:27:04-06:00

ID

125413

Comment

Gee Tom, I honestly thought you were black! Oh, well. I disagree with your crime per capita being worse 15 years ago. Murder was up, but I don't believe we had the level of property crime or car jackings or home invasions. We were experiencing a great deal of 'bad drug deals'. Crime was definitely hitting the Fondren area hard but it was different. In Belhaven you could not park your car on the street without fear of broken windows. Perhaps I am remembering wrongly but I just don't ever recall a time like this in my lifetime, which is a really long lifetime! You are right about Lumumba and his being able to activate a large portion of our community. You are also very right about institutional racism; most people do not even recognize this behavior even when pointed out to them specifically. Interesting times we live in..........I for one could do with some dullness about now.

Author

ChrisCavanaugh

Date

2007-02-13T14:32:34-06:00

ID

125414

Comment

Tom, I understand the motivations behind "black power," too, (at least as well as I can as a white person), even if I haven't seen a lot of evidence that separatism is the right answer, either. There is no strength in division that I can see. And I certainly get, historically, why blacks moved into, or created, their own towns to get away from racists. But what I'm referring to as bullsh!t here is more the extreme attitudes of some people that a capitol city is somehow supposed to make sense as a city that is all one race surrounded by suburbs of another race, with everyone distrusting each other. I am unabashed that I believe in the power of diversity, of living together and overcoming our problems. At the same time, I believe in the "tossed salad" approach of appreciating our various cultural heritages (at least the good ones) and of sharing what's great about those with our friends of other cultures.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T14:37:19-06:00

ID

125415

Comment

Oh, and I should add, that I understand that "black power" is not synonymous with separatism -- although the Advocate folks seem to think that it is, what with their "brown society" rhetoric and all. It's the forced separatism (no matter who tries to do it) that I disagree with. It's a disservice to all of us. Oh, and I agree completely with this: The deep irony of all this, though, is that Melton is not about Black Power. He's playing both sides. He might fire white officials and replace them with black youth and call that Black Power, but as long as he dehumanizes the black community in this city with the raids and the beatings and the KKK comparisons and so forth, he's just Bull Connor with a black face. I can't say that because nobody will or should believe it coming from a white man, but Chokwe Lumumba represents the interests of the community in a way I'll never be able to, and he's standing up to this whole mess, God bless him. This is the first time I think Melton has really been put on notice--all the AG stuff, all the DA stuff, can't really hurt him if he has the support of the community. But he's losing the support of the community. The oppressed can become the oppressors, and we all have to be vigilant to ensure that doesn't happen. With Lumumba on the case (and the airwaves), things may start to change. The pendulum has swung too far.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T14:39:28-06:00

ID

125416

Comment

Chris writes: Gee Tom, I honestly thought you were black! Heh! Thanks for this, man... I disagree with your crime per capita being worse 15 years ago. Murder was up, but I don't believe we had the level of property crime or car jackings or home invasions. Hell, you might be right. I need to look at the statistics. I see a 60% reduction in homicides and just take that to mean that all crime is down relative to then, but I really need to look at the actual data. Truth is that I'm not really scared of getting mugged or beaten. I'd just rather not get killed. That would be inconvenient! You are right about Lumumba and his being able to activate a large portion of our community. You are also very right about institutional racism; most people do not even recognize this behavior even when pointed out to them specifically. I sure don't. I think I'm so damn enlightened sometimes, maybe I talk a good game too, but I'm not. I had the good fortune to be raised in an integrated social environment, but just like every other white, I'm carrying around racist baggage. Interesting times we live in..........I for one could do with some dullness about now. Amen. I'd be happy if Melton just handed his administration over to his seconds (though preferably better seconds than he's got now) and just did the whole PR and hugs and so forth routine full-time. We can have him for 20 years for all I care as long as his job gets done and he stops hurting the city. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like he knows how to do that. Maybe losing the support of the community will teach him. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T14:58:20-06:00

ID

125417

Comment

Donna writes: Tom, I understand the motivations behind "black power," too, No need to put it in quotes; it's a very real thing. We've got white power, black power, and integrated/"brown" power in this city, and if you've been kicked in the teeth enough times by white power, why trust whites as allies? If I'm asking Stokes to oppose Melton because Melton is a lousy mayor, that's one thing. But if I'm asking Stokes to be an integrationist, then I'm asking Stokes to live up to a moral standard that I seriously doubt I'd ever be able to live up to if I were in his shoes. Hell, my ancestors were sweet people and they were segregationists. A lot of them fought for the Confederacy. Same genes (basically), different environment. My world is integrated. Stokes' apparently isn't. I can't take credit for that. It's the forced separatism (no matter who tries to do it) that I disagree with. It's a disservice to all of us. I disagree with it when I do it--one of my 2007 resolutions was to stay the hell away from nonprofit groups where all of the power and social inertia is concentrated in the hands of whites, no matter how worthy the cause. I'm tired of standing around in rooms full of white people. But I'm not going to condemn black separatists for looking out for the interests of the black community, for feeling like FUBU is the only way to go. I don't dare. Not when I live in a state where whites still voted by an overwhelming margin to keep the damn Confederate flag waving, where there's the Eastland name on the federal building, the Barnett name on the reservoir, Barbour and Lott in office, and so on and so forth. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T15:09:02-06:00

ID

125418

Comment

If there was a white mayor of Jackson taking the same actions that this mayor is taking would Team JFP label him a racist or just someone not respecting another's civil rights?

Author

colby

Date

2007-02-13T15:12:42-06:00

ID

125419

Comment

By the way, one thing I will say is that I don't think this separatism is of the forced variety. I think it's much more mundane than that. I mean, we both saw how few white faces there were at the Know Your Rights meeting on Medgar Evers Boulevard last year, and that was an ACLU event. Inertia is more than enough to keep separatism in place, and if we don't fight it, it'll never change. No villains needed. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T15:15:42-06:00

ID

125420

Comment

I don't know what Team JFP (whatever that is) would do, colby, but I would have started calling him a racist a long time ago if he were white. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T15:17:28-06:00

ID

125421

Comment

Colby, I think it's quite possible that smart folks might choose both your options. ;-) Also, obviously, a black man can be "racist" against members of his own race, if he pursues the same racist agenda as a white man. It's awfully sad, but it's certainly been done often enough over the years. I mean, the motivation for racism is often (usually? always?) as a way for the majority culture to wield power over a group of people who have less power because of their race and historical discrimination and lack of opportunities because of it. Certainly, a black person who figures out how to become part of that majority culture could play the same game, whether on their behalf or his own. Certainly, Mr. Melton is routinely targeting people without the historical power base to fight back. There is no question that, were he white, his actions would draw headlines in every media outlet in the country. And giving him a pass for doing the same thing because he's black is in itself racist—both against him for holding him to such a low standard because he's black and against the victims of his actions.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T15:38:24-06:00

ID

125422

Comment

No need to watch the tape Donna. I was there remember? I birthed the idea and lobbied to have candidates come and speak to MAP in the first place. Yep, some folks were put off, but underrstand there were folks in that room that didnt like the mayor anyway and his appearance wasn't going to change that. He had put some of those folks there in jail or contributed to them going. He was not the darling of the room believe me. But YOUR perception is clearly that YOUR perception of the tape. By and large the room was satisfied with what they saw. Hell, everybody in there from past dealings knew the mayor could shovel it! That's why they have no trust for politicians. the mayor, Harvey, Whitlow, anybody. Infact the only official who really gets a pass in Stokes. You're not giving those members credit for being sharp. you do one end then turn around and say they were duped on the other. Fact is, they took what the mayor said with a graiin of salt. The majority of the room had their own studios already and were budding entrepeneurs without the mayors help(repeating for the millionth time). They were expecting about the same out of him that they expected in the past...nothing..The same thing that the hood usually gets out of elections...nothing! But at least they felt the mayor wa in touch and actually made an effort and thats what won him the endorsement. Did I expect him to carry himself the same way or say the same thing at that breakfast HELL NO! that would be crazy. HE'S A POLITICIAN! that's what they do. Our job is to succeed despite their B.S. feel me? Nobody iin that room was fooled from the responses that I got. the reason why i make those comparisons is because you try to come off as if this "politician" behavior is just unique to the mayor...It's not. it's typical politician behavior that all the previous mayor exuded. Those folks made it clear that would prefer the devil that they know to the one that they didnt.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T16:41:04-06:00

ID

125423

Comment

I was there remember? Yes, but I've been in the middle of things myself and been very surprised to watch tapes and see photos and hear audio later. It's easy to be "caught up," so to speak. Otherwise, Kamikaze, don't talk down to me, either. I've talked to a number of people who were there who were offended. You don't speak for everybody, either, you know. Those folks made it clear that would prefer the devil that they know to the one that they didnt. That's a hilarious statement. Are you saying that y'all knew what Melton was going to turn out to be like and went for him anyway? Or did he not turn out to be what you thought he would. The mayor is "in touch"? How exactly? At that event, he kept saying the same thing over and over and over again, while not answering questions directly. What about that is being "in touch"?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T16:46:48-06:00

ID

125424

Comment

I just got in. I haven't had time to read all the comments yet. Let me just simply say: It's hard out here for a pimp; with the Cadilac and gas money spent, because a whole lot of _______ is jumping ship." "Big Pimping"!

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-13T16:49:12-06:00

ID

125425

Comment

And to answer your other question I say this. I operate on two levels in this city. There's the street side of Kaze and the corporate Suite side of Kaze...I have the unique perspective of seeing things from both sides of the issue. A vantage point that some folks don't get. Do I agree with the mayor sledgehammering that man's house. HELL NO! don't be ridiculous. If it was me Id be mad as hell. However, you don't know that area. don't live there and havent talked to EVERYONE over there. Drugs are rampant in that area and Ive run into my share of "sick" individuals who are sooooo disabled in some cases but well enough to sell crack or smoke it. Is Evans Welch schizophrenic, probably, but was he doing crack or selling it? probably. The mayor handled it wrong period! Even his head cheerleader Frank Bluntson said that,. Now is the mayor harassing dude at the Upper Level.. Yep! Im not in favor of police harassment at all. I hate it. I was there the night the "incident" happened and ik must say it was a "show" BUT...as a visitor to that club do I know what goes on in there...YEP! and is all of it legal...NOPE. It needs to be cleaned up, but again...he's handling it the wrong way. And lastly he handled the whole Micheal Black incident wrong. And *I* had a problem with the "damn thug" comment. But Black had a rapsheet a mile long and he shouldnt have been out anyway. It is what it is. He was probably running because he probably would have tasted some billy club when they did. That was probably trying to show some kind of "loyalty" to his officers who have long since lost some of their respect for him. Again, he was playing POLITICIAN..Am I mad for him giving a different speech in front of affluent whited folks NO, becuase its what they do. Hell, its what most folks do when *I* leave a room anyway..so again Im not surprised. As you've noticed...in this day and age..it takes ALOT to surprise or disappoint me.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T16:57:16-06:00

ID

125426

Comment

I don't think you're talking about a kitty cat, Ray. ;-) Is Evans Welch schizophrenic, probably, but was he doing crack or selling it? probably. The question isn't about "knowing" the area (and I have actually spent a bit of time over there, thanks for asking). It does not *matter* how bad the area is, or if Welch had sold a houseload of crack (which there is no evidence of)—the crimes are the same. And, no, Welch is not "probably" a schrizophrenic, Kaze. He was diagnosed as one and spent time in a the hospital for it. Nice way to represent folks there, Kaze. Otherwise, it's remarkable to me to hear you make excuses for Mr. Melton. Can you honestly say you would say the same thing if Melton were white?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:01:27-06:00

ID

125427

Comment

Well, I guess that's just one of those issues you either won't or can't understand. There was an election. Basically there were two choices. Either the mayor or H.J. and of the folks in that room folks felt if they had to choose which one of the two would be more understanding of their plight, more accessible, and more hands on with the hood, the answer was Melton. And yes the majority of the folks in that room figured that the maor would probably turn out to be full of s--t just like his predecessors. Sad but true and a perception that Im fighting to change. The hood doesnt trust politicians whoever they are.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T17:01:58-06:00

ID

125428

Comment

I would say EXACTLY the same thing. Especially if he's a Politician, damn near the whole lot of em are snake-oil salesmen. The mayor included. And I think you're missing the fact that Im basically on the same page. I think because Im not just rabid about getting rid of the mayor you're missing my point. Jackson has a problem. The mayor's not being effective and he's lost a lot of public trust(which for a politician is the death-knell) Im just not jumping up and down screaming about it. Because white or black IM NOT SURPRISED! And I apologize if you felt I was slighting Welch. Ill rephrase..Is he schizophrenic..YES. but, was he selling or smoking crack...PROBABLY. Do I agree with his house being destroyed NO! period.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T17:07:18-06:00

ID

125429

Comment

Also, don't some of your friends who are working for Melton now "have a rap sheet a mile long"? Do you want Donnie Money, for instance, beaten while in handcuffs? Would you say the same thing if he were? Am I mad for him giving a different speech in front of affluent whited folks NO, becuase its what they do. Well, then I guess that's the way to do it then, huh? What about what he SAID, Kaze? The giggling and snorting and the thug talk? The stuff that makes the community look so bad? That's OK because he then came over to y'all and offered a recording studio (that has never happened)? (And don't say that's not what was the draw at MAP, because he kept repeating the same thing over and over and over again, no matter the question. It'd be different if he actually answered any of the questions halfway intelligently.)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:08:00-06:00

ID

125430

Comment

"The mayor handled it wrong period!" Is that the understatement of the year? He not only helped tear down the house but instigated members of the youth you claim he is reaching out to, to help. And if he is "probably" selling drugs, why not have the police department investigate the matter and arrest him. And yeah, the Upper Level is the unofficial dope boy club in jackson, but the mayor has to respect the law instead of going on these meaningless raids.

Author

jd

Date

2007-02-13T17:10:48-06:00

ID

125431

Comment

I think you're basically on the same page, too, Kaze. But it bothers me that you, too, are willing to make excuses for a cop beating Michael Black while in handcuffs based on his rap sheet -- but you get outraged when people don't want the city to hire (recent) felons. One of the big issues here is hypocrisy on Melton's part. He chooses some young people who've been in trouble to work by his side, help him to questionable stuff, ride around on the Mobile Command Center, blah, blah—while others whose rap sheets aren't any worse than some of the prior ones are merely "thugs" to be beat up, made fun of, lied about and run out of town. Is this helping our needy young people? Is that "outreach"?

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:15:21-06:00

ID

125432

Comment

"Basically there were two choices. Either the mayor or H.J. and of the folks in that room folks felt if they had to choose which one of the two would be more understanding of their plight, more accessible, and more hands on with the hood, the answer was Melton. " I agree with you on that one. But i think after two years most people should feel like they made a mistake or they have there heads in the sand. You can't just lump melton in to politicians will be politicians. or all politicians lie. That may be so or so percieved but Melton is an entire different animal. He's not a politician, he is just plain weird and crazy. He wasn't hugged enough as a child, picked on by the bigger kids, whatever it was he shouldn't be excercising his deamons on the city of jackson's dime.

Author

jd

Date

2007-02-13T17:15:38-06:00

ID

125433

Comment

Well said, Jay.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:17:18-06:00

ID

125434

Comment

Not making an excuse Donna, Ive been unfairly beaten and accosted MANY times, even a few that werent by JPD(it was ridgeland police incidentally) I just stated my opinion. Sure the mayor chooses some and doesnt choose others but I would guess if its his time of money he could choose who he wishes. That's not an issue. I don't know what his criteria are. I ve seen him help boy or girl, white or black I dunno. that's on him. Donny incidentally doesnt work for the city anymore and Im none too happy about that. In fact, he's the one who told ME not to sweat it cuz HE knows the mayor beter than any of us and HE wasnt surprised either. He's been beaten and accosted before, he too knows the routine. But what we could do WHILE he was working for the city we continue to do OUTSIDE of him working for the city. I made sure of that. ya'll go ahead and dialogue about the mayor everyday, day in and day out. We're out doing something. And PLEASE, thats not to say that ya'll arent cuz Im sure ya'll are, its to say that regardless of whose mayor, a change can happen. and im not outraged when folks don't want to hire felons, Donna Im outraged at hypocrisy and holier-than-thou types who are free of sin and gives others only one chance to be "perfect". that's where my outrage comes from. Donny was and still is the perfect candidate to talk to these kids. He was well suited to be in the youth division, as is Staffeny. Armstrong is qualified to do whats he doing now. and Robert Williams was suited for his. But there are those who feel like they should never be allowed to assimilate with "good folks". cast em out with the lepers

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T17:34:41-06:00

ID

125435

Comment

It hard out here for a pimp, with the city council and the judge on my tip, with my probation officer talking to the press, going to jail is causing me stress. But I... I keep hustling! I keep hustling! Keep hustling. When I ride around town, I don't know what to do. Upper Deck here. Ghetto night there. Some times I just walk my dog! I keep hustling. I keep hustling. It hard out here for a pimp, facing jail and ridicule, with half my friends and fans running away, a whole lot of _______ is jumping ship. Y'all don't know! Y'all don't know! But, I keep hustling. I keep hustling.

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-13T17:41:44-06:00

ID

125436

Comment

Sure the mayor chooses some and doesnt choose others but I would guess if its his time of money he could choose who he wishes. That's not an issue. Oh, but it is, when he is working on the taxpayers' dime, Kaze. This is a primary reason that he belongs in the private sector where he is not discriminating when he plays favorites. You know I like Donny, and I hope he will continue to talk to young people now that he's back in the private sector. You're still, though, not addressing the inherent hypocrisy in your own words—about Michael Black's rap sheet, as opposed to that of the men you name. You're doing at least a little bit of what Melton himself does—picking and choosing. I'll also say that a belief that convicted felons should not be on the city payroll is not the same as saying they should not "assimilate with good folks." I personally do not think it is appropriate for a man convicted of bribery while working for the city to now come back and try to get grants for the city. That has nothing to do with assimilation. It's just bad business. If I fire someone for mishandling money, I'm not going to hire them back to handle money. That doesn't mean I don't think they should be able to get a good job, or to vote. As for your rhetoric about "holier-than-thou types who are free of sin and gives others only one chance to be 'perfect'," that is simply rhetoric and doesn't even deserve a response, being that no one has actually said that. You'll get further in these discussions if you don't put ridiculous words in people's mouths.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:43:09-06:00

ID

125437

Comment

Again Donna, wasnt saying you. But that is what Ive encountered. Having a concern is one thing but what Ive heard out here and on Kim's show IS ridiculous. If you're "concerned" and "asking some questions" thats cooooool. but Im talking about the "perfect" people. And further, I believe it was WLBT or WJTV, it was already mentioned that he WOULD NOT be handling any money. Hell, if he was *I* would have to question the sanity of that. What do you want me to say, it was wrong for them to beat Black while he was in handcuffs, of course it was, THAT is ridiculous. But how about YOU watching the film of them chasing him. What should Black have done? what would YOU have done? and if YOU were the police, what would YOU have done.?

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T17:49:45-06:00

ID

125438

Comment

Uhm, I've never been a police officer, but I'd like to think I wouldn't pound on a handcuffed suspect. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T17:51:26-06:00

ID

125439

Comment

OK, I'll give you that. They're out there. We know it. They're the ones who push for voter ID and don't want felons to ever vote again (until it's someone in their own family). I know that's true. Uh, I would not have beaten Michael Black in handcuffs. That part is simple. And I would not defend that in any form or fashion.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T17:52:09-06:00

ID

125440

Comment

unh unhhhhhh Donna, ALSO, what would you have done if you were Black? You saw the footage.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T17:56:43-06:00

ID

125441

Comment

I don't understand that question, Kaze. I've never argued that anything Michael Black did while committing his crime(s) was right. Or Donny. Or Anthony. Or anyone else. Do you understand what the U.S. Constitution is? It protects people who do wrong things, like all those buddies of yours you defend constantly. And that's what it has to do in order to work. That is, you don't get constitutional rights "if." You get constitutional rights "despite." And, by the way, my tax dollars don't pay Black's salary.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T18:07:41-06:00

ID

125442

Comment

thats cool Donna but still. You saw the footage. If YOU were HIM, what would YOU have done? Did you see the track meet? And what do you think could have made the outcome different. Think.. 'cuz you're talking to someone whose been "billy-clubbed". It aint right..plain and simple I think you're missing that when I say it. All I want to know is what would YOU have done if you were Black. and BTW your tax-dollars are paying for him in a way cuz they will be paying to house him in a correctional facility so your answer IS an important one.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T18:14:28-06:00

ID

125443

Comment

Kaze, your question doesn't make any sense. There is no relevance to it. There is no question to answer here. You don't beat someone in handcuffs, period. This is remarkable. Obviously, I know my tax dollars are paying to house him. And will over and over again when police violence causes recividism. (Read the studies.) And would pay for expensive lawsuits against the city for a dumbass cop who beats him while he's in handcuffs. And for the other career criminals and lawsuits that the cop's actions would lead to.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T18:19:56-06:00

ID

125444

Comment

And would pay for expensive lawsuits against the city for a dumbass cop who beats him while he's in handcuffs. And for the other career criminals and lawsuits that the cop's actions would lead to. ladd Man, you could build Doug Anderson 10 parking garages and two jails with the money paid in lawsuits for cops getting caught doing stupid stuff. ;-)

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-13T18:52:17-06:00

ID

125445

Comment

Anyone who defends in any way the violation of poor people's rights is an enemy of those people. Either we have a constitution for everyone or let's revert to our pistols for justice (who needs courts). Cops who beat handcuffed suspects are criminals/thugs in uniform. If Melton were white...there is no question that Mr. Stokes, the Advocate, and many others would CERTAINLY not support his violations of poor people's rights. Those among them who deny this are shameless hypocrites.

Author

FreeClif

Date

2007-02-13T19:26:58-06:00

ID

125446

Comment

Im trying to find the post where I said that it was ok to beat someone in handcuffs....Coming from someone who has got the business end of one that would be ridiculous. But the reason i asked (But of course you felt like MY question was not worth answering) is if you havent ran from the cops, been beaten by the cops, accosted by the cops, or harassed by the cops then you're not understanding my point. It aint right to beat someone in handcuffs. Ill leave it at that. And cops ARE thugs in uniforms.

Author

Kamikaze

Date

2007-02-13T19:38:01-06:00

ID

125447

Comment

"Statements of fact are very different than statements of opinion, legally and otherwise. It continually amazes me that people don't understand the difference." I won't respond to your peevish condescension, but consider what you are saying about opinion versus fact. Opinions are, as you note, often thrown about, but responsible journalists also often note when those opinions are totally misinformed. Its your job, as they say, to check the facts behind the opinion. Are you honestly telling me that Gannet presenting the "opinions" of the Melton campaign, unchallenged, during the entire election was not an abrogation of their responsibilities as journalists? My point is that you have an obligation beyond simply presenting unsubstantiated opinion masquerading as fact, which, as far as I can tell is exactly what Lumumba's comments were. An these were not simply innocuous opinions as you damn well know. They were targeted comments meant to divorce Melton of black community support by suggesting that he is a pawn of white interests. Call a spade a spade Donna. I would hope you are not so naive to really draw the line between an unchallenged opinion and fact. History, especially civil rights history, is replete with unchallenged opinion which morphs into "fact" by the consensus of an uninformed public. Do your job, call him out on crap like this. WHAT white business owners? Which businesses? This kind of backhanded racial slur pervades the entire audio clip and you damn well know it. Melton is wrong, but spinning this to a white black issue is stupid.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-13T20:59:31-06:00

ID

125448

Comment

"Peevish condescension"—I love that phrase, I'm going to use it myself if you don't mind. What's funny to me, Niles, is that you are just *now* showing up to complain about a statement of opinion as quoted by a newspaper—which happens all the time. In fact, that's what most quotes are. I'm not being condescending—I'm actually stating a fact—when I say that people often do not understand the difference. I'm reading a book right now by an academic in journalism and sociology who talks about how many so-called "objective" news stories are long strings of opinion statements quoted by the reporter, with little in between. The point is, obviously, that Chokwe made that statement as his opinion, and he gets to. It is protected legally, and journalistically, as it is expressed both by him and by the piece it's quoted in in such a way that makes it clear that it's opinion. The problem becomes when such people states facts that are unsubstantiated without framing it as opinion. In this case, the opinion is so apparent that it's laughable to me that it bothers you so from a journalistic standpoint, considering the numerous better examples we could use as a discussion point. The problem here, I suspect, is that you are personally offended by Chokwe's use of race in his statement of opinion that you want to jump all over it and lambaste the messinger. The funny part is that Lumumba is not making such an outrageous statement that it could not be true. Clearly, very rich white forces supported Melton in his bid to be mayor, and they want stuff from him. They've gotten some of it already. And in his appearance between the ladies at Bravo, Melton himself used rhetoric and direct statements to tell them that he was pretending to be a black Democrat just so he could win in Jackson, while in fact he was not, as they giggled knowingly. I was there. I know. He also used the race card both to help him with black people and then with white people during the campaign, depending on who he was talking to. Thus, for anyone informed about Melton's use of his own race status—which he admitted doing—during the campaign in order to get votes, there is nothing particularly shocking about Chokwe's statement of opinion. I feel very comfortable running his statement as opinion. Obviously, people will choose to agree with him or not. Not to mention: It is so apparently opinion that few people would mistake it as a statement of fact that needed to be factchecked before it could run. However, I can understand if you don't *like* it, but trying to disguise that in a stern lecture of me for running his statement simply misses the mark and wastes both of our time. Holla.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T21:15:21-06:00

ID

125449

Comment

You're also skipping the part where, if one followed your logic that every statement of opinion has to be factchecked, that many people would, in effect, end up censored. (That academic talks about that, too.) That is, Chokwe says: "I believe that Melton is closing down the Upper Level because many of his white supporters want him to." Your brand of editor says: "Well, that's his opinion, but we don't run opinion that isn't factchecked. Go call all of Melton's rich white supporters and ask them if they are telling him to raid that club regularly without a warrant to close it down. If they don't admit that they are, we won't quote Chokwe's opinion." See the problem there? Often, opinion by the fact of its very opinion-ness is not factcheckable. Trust me: I deal with these kinds of questions every day. (Now, had Melton called us back on this one, we would have asked him for a response. And I'm sure it would have been a doozy. But he didn't.) A hint to you: You would probably get farther if you make solid arguments about why you think Chokwe's opinion is wrong rather than trying to scare up a flimsy reason why we are pond-scum because we quoted him. In order words, argue on the merits.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T21:24:26-06:00

ID

125450

Comment

Don't borrow too heavily, I probably lifted it; I am the original intellectual kleptomaniac! Actually, I was absent from most of the other examples I think you are referring to. I have not had the time recently to read as much as I would like. First, attacking the motives of your posters detracts from your imposing argumentative ability. What difference do my motives make? Is there a litmus test for calling bullshit? At any rate, I disagree with your hyper technical distinction between the presentation of opinion and statements of fact. In fact, statements of opinion often carry the baggage of assumed antecedent facts, whether they are presented as mere opinion. This is, as you no doubt know, a classic tool of good propaganda. We don't assert the fact, we assert an opinion which, if you agree with it, assumes the facts. Chokwe's statement of opinion relies on the antecedent facts, among others, that Melton 1) being used by white business owners and 2) that some specific white business owners, being bigots, are concerned with a "black club" in the area. I simply challenged the antecedent facts upon which Mr. Lumumba's statements were based. Obviously if this was an opinion about something innocuous, who would care? But its not. It goes to the heart of a serious issue, so I would like some follow up. General statement of what you "know" about Melton's campaign are non responsive to the original argument. Who cares? You concede that there is no evidence that any white business owners are behind Melton's bizarre antics at the upper level? Please, if I am wrong, direct me to the cabal and I will apologize.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-13T21:35:03-06:00

ID

125451

Comment

Chokwe's statement of opinion relies on the antecedent facts, among others, that Melton 1) being used by white business owners and 2) that some specific white business owners, being bigots, are concerned with a "black club" in the area. You're right: Those are unbelievable, outlandish statements of opinion that could not possibly be true. Ahem. You concede that there is no evidence that any white business owners are behind Melton's bizarre antics at the upper level? Don't put words in my mouth: I'm not conceding that there is no evidence of that. I am saying that Chokwe has the right to have his *opinion* aired. He has made no statement of fact about a particular business person to check. The only person he is talking about directly is Melton, a public figure who has made no secret about his allegiance to his supporters during this campaign. There is simply no booger-bear here, Niles. Give the bashing-the-messinger a rest and discuss whatever *point* you'd like to make on its merits. It just comes across like you don't want Chokwe's comment aired at all—and if you have such a strong argument against it, you should want it out there so you can jump on it and tear it down. Instead, you're jumping on the fact that someone dared quote him saying something you don't like. Tsk, tsk, slap my wrist. And, no, Chokwe's statement of opinion does not rely on those statements of fact that you share. (And they are faulty on their face, as the white business owners might not want a black club because they dislike rap, for instance, because they think it attracts crime, not *necessarily* because they're bigots.) His opinion relies on what his opinion is. He is not presenting a clear statement of fact within that opinion, which could prove problematic. (Like had he declared as fact: "Melton went into the Upper Level nightclub because Mr. Joe Blow called him Saturday night and asked him to." Now, *that* would need a good ole factcheck. And it's kinda funny that you are accusing me of being hyper-technical here. ;-) I'm actually responding to your faulty argument, which is framed as an attack on me and my paper for running Chokwe's opinion rather than a challenge of his statement itself. I'm not being hyper-technical at all; I'm actually sharing some of the basic rules that abound in the circles I run in every day. If you don't want to hear my response, I suggest that you not bait me into giving you one, friend.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T22:53:53-06:00

ID

125452

Comment

Heh. Now you are being baited? oh c'mon. Anytime anyone challenges you its baiting. You bait with the best of them, so cut me some slack. Let me clarify, I am not attacking you or your paper and did not intend to frame my comments that way. Rather I asked what was a very simple question, which was if there was factual support given for the statement made by Lumumba as to white business owners specifically wanting Melton to shut down the upper level because they were uncomfortable with a black club in that area. Turning to your arguments. Okay, so the factual antecedents of Lumumba's opinion are not outlandish, fair enough. I'll ask again, which Businesses in that area, Who? When did they say this? I did not say they were outlandish, I implied that they were presumptively false without any factual support. Much as Lumumba implied that they were presumptively true despite his lack of facts. You are dissembling, I made my point in the original post, that the assertion that white business owners are behind Melton's antics is factually unsupported. Furthermore, based on listening to the audio and your comments I can state now that I believe they are, in my opinion, false, but I welcome facts to disabuse me of that opinion. Given your personal experience with the Mayor and the fact that he himself is a racial opportunist, I may very well be dead wrong on this point, but how about some facts instead of insults? Specifically, and importantly, Mr. Lumumba did not give his opinion in generalities about who supported Melton, as your defense above does; rather, Mr. Lumumba instead gave his opinion that specific white business owners in the area were uncomfortable with the upper level in that area. That is a far cry from generalized opinion because it requires specific antecedent facts as I stated above. That is not a faulty argument but it is one you may dislike because it calls into question the motivation of someone you like. Sorry about that. If the facts are there, e.g. there was a specific white business owner in that area who motivated this, donated to Melton on conditions involving the upper leve, etc., then fine, tell me about it and I will shut up. Until then, its simply idiotic to say that prefacing an inflammatory accusation like that with "its only my opinion" sterilizes and immunizes it. Its equally dumb to attack me for pointing out that the statement is bunk. I do not want to put words in your mouth but it is almost impossible to argue any point here without drawing that accusation. Okay, so you do not concede that there is no evidence supporting Lumumba's statement. So, where is the evidence? Could you share it? Lumumba made a pretty bold assertion, but, just to be clear, there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that it is true. I attacked the message, not the messenger. The messenger stepped up, however, to defend the message, which I find bizarre. Here, let me see if I can be more deferential: Dear Ms. Ladd, It appears to me that Mr. Lumumba's statements regarding specific white business owners being the motivation for the mayor's recent actions are provocative and unfounded. I am shocked that they went unchallenged by the vanguard of the investigative press, the JFP. While not wishing in any way to impugn your journalistic skill or integrity, could you clarify for me when, if ever, the sharp end of the JFP will challenge such obvious racial opportunism?

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-13T23:40:55-06:00

ID

125453

Comment

Niles, I think that Chokwe Lumumba's statement, presented as it was, obviously falls under the category of testimony. People who consider Lumumba a reliable source are going to be inclined to believe it and people who don't consider Lumumba a reliable source are going to be disinclined to believe it, but it is what it is. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T23:41:07-06:00

ID

125454

Comment

And may I say, for the record, that I believe him. I don't think his statement is applicable to all white business owners in the neighborhood, but I have seen enough of white Jackson to know that if a black club opens up on a street, open at strange hours of the night with lots of drinking and partying, some people aren't going to like that. I've also see enough of Melton to know that he obviously has a personal bone to pick with the Upper Level, and that's the only explanation I've heard so far that makes sense. Do you have an alternative explanation to suggest? Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-13T23:43:06-06:00

ID

125455

Comment

Not really Tom, I get you but it just sucks you feel that way. I am not denying the reality of it, but I don't have to like it. Just like it sucks that Lumumba is so fundamentally keyed to race that its all he can figure out to explain the Mayor's behavior. Just sick of it. On all sides. Its dumb. It kept us in the gutter for years and will for years more. Either way, the Mayor can stand or fall without racial reference at all. We got him with racial unity, lets get him out with the same unity.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-13T23:52:25-06:00

ID

125456

Comment

Anytime anyone challenges you its baiting. Niles, that statement is factually illogically on its face. I think I've made every point three times, and yes you are baiting me. I don't want you to be "deferential"; I want you to stop wasting my time with illogical statements. A challenging debate about an issue is one thing; however, you are baiting (and switching) here for whatever reason in your attempt to challenge Chokwe's opinion and why we ran it as such, rather than simply stating that you disagree and give your reasons (which you haven't done. And it's mighty arrogant to say that someone's opinion about a public officials motive (or anything else) is preumptively false because it is not proved to you. That's worth a giggle. Otherwise, your latest tirade is tiresome and repetitive, so I'll only respond now to this one line because it is rather representative of your other "points": That is not a faulty argument but it is one you may dislike because it calls into question the motivation of someone you like. Two things: I called this statement of yours "faulty" and explained why already: Chokwe's statement of opinion relies on the antecedent facts, among others, that Melton 1) being used by white business owners and 2) that some specific white business owners, being bigots, are concerned with a "black club" in the area. You're the one making assumptions there. Secondly, I think it's funny that you work into that sentence that I'm calling out your bad argument because, uh, I "like" Chokwe. For what it's worth, Chokwe and I have have had a squabble of sorts in the past, and I haven't been around him enough to "like" him or "dislike" him personally. And the thought that I would answer this kind of charge, or defend someone, based on that anyone is really cut. I mean, I *like* Melton. Think it through, Niles. Now, my part of this tete-a-tete is over. I don't appreciate being baited, and I don't appreciate people trying to put words in my mouth or motives in my head. Please debate issues if you'd like, but the personal stuff is getting old.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-13T23:57:11-06:00

ID

125457

Comment

Sorry... I was looking for the Battlestar Galactica Fan thread? ;-)

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-14T00:06:19-06:00

ID

125458

Comment

Oh good lord, talk about quibbling, okay a "position you like". My latest tirade? Ouch! I think I will go watch some battlestar galactica.

Author

Niles Hooper

Date

2007-02-14T00:29:20-06:00

ID

125459

Comment

Battlestar Galactica is some damn good television. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T01:39:31-06:00

ID

125460

Comment

I'm sorry, but I'm feeling inspired: The club, the club, the club is uptown We don't need no warrant, shut the motherf--ker down! Why do I get the feeling Frank Melton is going to be immortalized in song many times before this is all over. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T01:41:44-06:00

ID

125461

Comment

I think it would have been safer (and less open to misinterpretation) if Mr Lumumba would have simply said "club" rather than his racially charged opinion. I know from personal experience on South State St years back that drunks in large numbers are not a smart bunch. One such club got shut down after their patrons got the idea to smash up the store I worked at. That prompted an inspection which shut them down. When they came back months later, the police were the last to know they'd reopened and were running illegally. I had to tell them they'd been open a week. This was before they'd recieved permit to open #1. So nightclubs/bars/whatever can be bad, as I see it.

Author

Ironghost

Date

2007-02-14T09:54:38-06:00

ID

125462

Comment

It's hard out here for a pimp, with your freedom and your movement bent. I don't wanna be mayor, I rather be a playa. I wanna be a cop, cops are tops. The haters won't leave me along, they say they want me gone. I can't do my job, they got me acting like a frog. I think I'll stay away from the office and just walk my dog. The judge and prosecutor they got me scared. I would just resign but that would show I got no behind. That probation officer got me lying, there ain't no denying. Sometime I feel like I'm frying! But, in the meantime, I'll keep hustling. And you know it. I'll keep hustling. Ya'll wouldn't understand. I Keep hustling. I keep hustling.

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-14T10:09:09-06:00

ID

125463

Comment

I just want to know who the final five are. I think its either starbuck or the president and I think Sharon knows who it is.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-14T10:16:17-06:00

ID

125464

Comment

Sorry I'm posting this a bit late, but The Clarion-Ledger's story on Monday's City Council committee meeting was even more oblivious to what happened than usual. Here's our story: Police Officers Flood City Hall.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2007-02-14T12:00:59-06:00

ID

125465

Comment

And Kingfish, that is crazy talk. Why would Sharon know who the final five are? And while we're at it, which Sharon?

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2007-02-14T12:02:11-06:00

ID

125466

Comment

Helo's. I was watching some of 2.0 last night and in The Farm, Sharon told her she had a special destiny.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-14T12:08:52-06:00

ID

125467

Comment

Some of us (being masochists) apparently wait until the seasons come out on DVD to watch any of the eps, counting on the grace of God--oops, the gods, yeah, not a Cylon here, nosiree, honest--to avoid spoilers, so out of respect for that, I'll make a cryptic prediction: Sharon doesn't know who the final five are...but one of them recently stabbed a prisoner in the neck, and one of the other ones has a "destiny." The other three, I suspect, will remain shrouded in mystery for a while. Just a guess. We'll see if I'm right! Oh, anybody else watch Rome, by the way...? Because season two is SO getting good. There won't be a season three, but if season two concludes with the historical event I think it will (e.g., the beginning of the 40-year reign of Emperor Augustus), it would make for a pretty dull season three anyway. I am beginning to like Vorenus and Pullo again, which probably means that one of them is about to get the axe. Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T12:14:19-06:00

ID

125468

Comment

Clue me, fish! What in the hell are you talking about?

Author

Ray Carter

Date

2007-02-14T12:14:28-06:00

ID

125469

Comment

Ooh. Fish, I had forgotten about that. So Sharon probably does know, but how on Earth did she find out? Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T12:15:14-06:00

ID

125470

Comment

I prefer to get the dvd's and watch them. Makes for a fun evening as there is only 38 minutes or so of new material anyway. Poor baltar, he don't get no respect from no body. Keeps on bringing it on himself, never stands up for anything.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-14T12:20:15-06:00

ID

125471

Comment

Sorry guys... There really is a Battlestar Galactica Fan thread by Philip... here!

Author

pikersam

Date

2007-02-14T12:21:21-06:00

ID

125472

Comment

actually Sharon already admitted to adama she could recognize some of the others. That was why he got so mad at her because she wouldn't tell him.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-14T12:23:02-06:00

ID

125473

Comment

Ray, The Cylons were created by man. They rebelled. There are many copies. And they have a plan. Unlike Frank Melton. See, if he were a Cylon, we'd all be so much better off! Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T12:24:43-06:00

ID

125474

Comment

I thought it was the trolls.

Author

Kingfish

Date

2007-02-14T12:28:08-06:00

ID

125475

Comment

How did this go from Lumumba & Frank to Battlestar Gallactica?

Author

golden eagle '97

Date

2007-02-14T14:45:56-06:00

ID

125476

Comment

How did this go from Lumumba & Frank to Battlestar Gallactica? Doesn't it always? ;-)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-14T15:02:25-06:00

ID

125477

Comment

BTW, the news all over the place is quoting Bush today saying that, although he can't prove it, he believes that the Iranian government is supplying arms to Iraq. That is clearly his opinion. And the media quoted him stating it. Imagine.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-14T15:06:12-06:00

ID

125478

Comment

(BTW, I will suspend anyone without notice who gives up a plot point in Battlestar Galactica, being that we are so far behind watching them on DVD. Be forewarned.)

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2007-02-14T15:07:10-06:00

ID

125479

Comment

So I guess that means we can't mention the drag-revue musical episode where Adama wore a thong and pasties? Cheers, TH

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T15:40:49-06:00

ID

125480

Comment

(Because I really think his version of "I Will Survive" rocked. And his dancing was a little off-rhythm, but the backup dancers covered well for that.)

Author

Tom Head

Date

2007-02-14T15:41:50-06:00

ID

125481

Comment

Is there anybody on this forum that really cares about the bigger issue concerning crime in Jackson? yes it was very tragic about the deaths that occured at the club..but it's not the whole issue....obviously frank melton has ruffled a few feathers..as rich as frank melton is, he could have just sit in his office and do paperwork, go to a few ribbon cutting ceremonies..but what person do you know that is as rich as frank melton that bothers to hang around a bunch of poor black people..nobody but frank.....people have forgotten about the raid he and the rest of the officers of the Mississippi bureau of narcotics did on the rich white neighborhood of Annandale in Madison..and some people also have forgotten about the white-owned strip clubs that he tried to shut down..The few handful of so-called burgeoisie African Americans that are still living in the city of Jackson, don't care too much for the mayor...somebody please tell me why are we hearing so much noise out of the NAACP and the ACLU? you mean to tell me that Black people were so much better off in this city when Harvey Johnson was in office?....and who is Chokwe Lumumba!?!?!?!?!......I seriously doubt he is really worried about the civil rights of black people....I heard (and somebody can check this out if they want to.) he got into some kind of trouble and had his law license suspended...Low income and poor black people who are good citizens are the pawn in this whole situation...In the sixteen years since I have been out of the Navy, I have seen no visible signs of progress any where that is until the current mayor got into office...One could ask the question if the signs of change in the city were already in motion when the last mayor left, why did it take so long?..You have to realize that Mayor Melton feels the need to micro-manage everything in city government because he expects eveybody in city government to be as passionate and dedicated about moving this city forward as he is..How can Mayor Melton get anything done in the city if he doesn't have cooperation?....I don't see anybody else doing anything better..If anybody else can do better, then they should run for mayor....I mean what would you do in a situation like the mayor faced when he first came into office and started cleaning house in city government?...No one in city or county government should be allowed to hold office 10 to 15 years and show no visible signs of improvment in their department...People have had these jobs for so long and they haven't had anyone looking over their shoulders to make sure they are properly doing their job...It shouldn't have to be that way but it is..To me it looks real bad when the leader of the city is out on the street trying to fight crime and improve the living conditions of poor people and all you get is a bunch of people complaining and stirring up mess...If these so-called civil rights organizations are really interrested in the rights of black people and poor people in general, why aren't they trying to help in some kind of way to fix the social ills of this city...you have got to realize it's a divide and conquer thing among the black people in this city....burgeoisie vs the low-income poor...The civil rights organizations don't really care about what really matters...Part of the situation is about Frank Melton getting too much press...good or bad...compared to all of the good things that the mayor has attempted to do, what have you seen the NAACP or the ACLU do? Absolutely nothing that I can see...What rathole strip club that you know of that can afford a out of town lawyer?..I definitely have more to say at a future date....

Author

nosweat

Date

2007-03-06T01:50:12-06:00

ID

125482

Comment

Nosweat - man, you are jaded. What has Frank done to move this city forward? Let's talk about crime. If Frank would hire a competent police chief, the police department could effectively fight crime. Crime in all areas of this city has skyrocketed since Frank took office! Crime in North and NE Jackson has tripled, armed robberies are occuring EVERY day and criminals aren't doing this because Frank doesn't have a gun and badge anymore. I really don't understand your logic (for lack of a better word) for supporting this egomaniac! He has consistantly lied to the public, he has no respect for the law and he can't leave "the children" alone. If Frank really wanted to help these kids he should help them from afar, because too many of the ones he has "helped" are dealing, dead or in jail. PLEASE point out to me what Frank has done to move this city forward!

Author

Fitz

Date

2007-03-06T10:07:25-06:00