Jackson Free Press

Read this provocative piece in the Times about, well, us:

What may have ended on Election Day, though, is the centrality of the South to national politics. By voting so emphatically for Senator John McCain over Mr. Obama — supporting him in some areas in even greater numbers than they did President Bush — voters from Texas to South Carolina and Kentucky may have marginalized their region for some time to come, political experts say. The region's absence from Mr. Obama's winning formula means it "is becoming distinctly less important," said Wayne Parent, a political scientist at Louisiana State University. "The South has moved from being the center of the political universe to being an outside player in presidential politics."

One reason for that is that the South is no longer a solid voting bloc. Along the Atlantic Coast, parts of the "suburban South," notably Virginia and North Carolina, made history last week in breaking from their Confederate past and supporting Mr. Obama. Those states have experienced an influx of better educated and more prosperous voters in recent years, pointing them in a different political direction than states farther west, like Alabama, Arkansas, Louisiana and Mississippi, and Appalachian sections of Kentucky and Tennessee.

Southern counties that voted more heavily Republican this year than in 2004 tended to be poorer, less educated and whiter, a statistical analysis by The New York Times shows.

Previous Comments

ID

140560

Comment

And you thought I was over-reacting when I said I could sense the anger in my white co-workers: people who are "supposedly" educated, aware, well-traveled, people. Those comments from Mississippians in that NY Times piece were real and speak to the issue at hand, We will ever escape our past? I want to be hopeful but it's hard. Those comments give you a glance into the kitchen conversations in white homes. I'm no fan of Bush, but I always reminded my children that he was the President and deserved respect even if you don't agree with him. There is no such term as "racial conservatism", let's call it what it really is.... RACISM.

Author

lanier77

Date

2008-11-11T11:54:01-06:00

ID

140561

Comment

Wow! Powerful article. Its funny that the white people in the article feared that we black folk would become more aggressive. I suppose they long for a time when we all just sat back and let the good white "Christians" have their way. Its scary how under-educated and un-informed people are. This is a clarion call for our educational system to be overhauled. Forget, the question is the South irrelevant. If we on a whole are that naive, maybe its a good thing we're have become irrelevant.

Author

dd39203

Date

2008-11-11T12:00:52-06:00

ID

140564

Comment

I said earlier a very smart person predicted the southern strategy would die last Tuesday. I don't know if it died but it certainly took a near fatal blow. Not only did Strum Thurmond and Jessie Helms and the likes need to kick the bucket; Elizabeth Dole, Kay Bailey Hutchison and the likes need to go away too. Dole lost Tuseday thankfully, and Hutchison is talking about resigning or not running for reelection and running for governor istead. I just hope the south and its evil leaders will one day get what both deserves while still living on earth for their horrible history of racism. And again, I say, I don't know how any decent and intelligent black person can be a republican or a supporter, not to mention a southern republican or supporter with southern republicans' blatant, proud and intractable history of racism. I certainly hope the south is politically irrelevant, but even this is better than what it deserves.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T12:26:15-06:00

ID

140567

Comment

while another volunteered that she was bothered by the idea of a black man “over me” in the White House. Just take out the part "in the White House" at the end and you'll understand what she REALLY means by the "over me" comment. Some of this stuff is extremely thinly veiled and based on very, very old archetypal racist ideas/stories.

Author

Lori G

Date

2008-11-11T12:38:26-06:00

ID

140568

Comment

Booman points out the southern strategy is not dead, but is now susceptible to a new, progressive southern strategy: http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2008/11/11/62927/656 The demographic trends say the old strategy to exploit racist resentments will continue to fail unless they tweak it. There are not enough uneducated mountainous areas to build a winning coalition as people become more educated and the Hispanic population increases.

Author

FreeClif

Date

2008-11-11T12:47:12-06:00

ID

140569

Comment

I like this part of that Booman link: Maybe Nossiter thinks you can't be Southern and educated at the same time. Maybe he thinks that Virginia and North Carolina have educated themselves right out of the South. Hell, I don't know what he means. I think Virginia, North Carolina, and Florida were pretty integral to Barack Obama's plan of victory. Look at how much money he spent to win those three states. It turned out that they were superfluous, but that doesn't mean that Obama won't be keenly interested in winning them in 2012. In fact, the Republicans are going to need a strategy to take all three states back if they're going to have any chance of winning a national election. What Nossiter notes is that parts of the South, including almost all of Appalachia, gave McCain a higher percentage of their votes than they gave to George W. Bush. The only explanation for that is that the people of that region are racist and believed rumors that the 'Hussein guy' is a Muslim. I think they'll get over that feeling by the second State of the Union address. The South has not been marginalized as a region. They just become less united, that's all I'll have more to say on this later once we finish replacing our entire Melton coverage package today. Grrr. I think Nossiter's premise is overly simplistic and doesn't take into account how different our younger voters are from the older ones. We have a generational shift coming, too, and some day the rest of the country is going to notice it. More later.

Author

DonnaLadd

Date

2008-11-11T12:52:33-06:00

ID

140570

Comment

There is a thin line between love and hate and something in between, many people have discovered. I've always liked or appreciated being placed in situations where women who supposedly hated me or were closed off from me had to interact honestly with me. I'll bet my last penny that I could win over 90% of them if they're decent, honest and intelligent people. The other 10% will be exposed as complete and utter nuts. Maybe I'm nuts for believing I can do this! Obama has this confidence and talent too. He even tried valiantly to win over white males too, something I have been quite reluctant to try, thus far.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T12:53:42-06:00

ID

140571

Comment

Re *anyone not upset with Mr. Obama’s victory should seek religious forgiveness* and * there are going to be outbreaks from blacks* Ha Ha. I know it makes some folks mad (mass deporters maybe?) but, these uneducated backwoods folk are a dying breed --- literally (hopefully).

Author

FreeClif

Date

2008-11-11T13:04:17-06:00

ID

140572

Comment

Head for the Hills! Looking at the map of counties (in the Times article) that voted in greater numbers for McCain in 2008 than for Bush in 2004, it looks to me like folks who are farther to the right than Bush have already headed for the hills (except in Louisiana).

Author

gwilly

Date

2008-11-11T13:07:14-06:00

ID

140573

Comment

As to black folks becoming more aggressive now that Obama is the president-elect, this might be the case with some. But I would argue it's pride instead being confused as aggression. I was a proud Negro before Obama won. You only live once and shouldn't be afraid to stand up for something good and right. I don't have to worry about any racist skeletons jumping out the closet on me because there aren't any in there. I prove it every day of my life as I interact with others unlike me. I'm not afraid to call a racist or prejudice person one of the same when I have studied the them or the situation and know I'm right. While I know there is a great tendency on the part of some to call me racist because I refuse to bite my tongue, or circumscribe what I say, I don't care. If they followed me around for a while they would conclude I'm the least affected or controlled by race of any person they have ever met. White folks aren't the only ones in town with feelings or fears or worries. History undoubtedly tells us we have lots to worry about. Black folks have suffered tremendously while worrying unnecessarily and rather unfairly over white folks' feelings. I can take the hate coming my way for being courageous enough to challenge the status quo when they're wrong, mistaken, dishonest, careless, evil, etc.. Some times to this day, I want to give up on the south. Too many people aren't seemingly any good and worse they want people like me to respect their racist and prejudice upbringing, socialization, power, position, et al. I can't do it. I won't do it!

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T13:22:51-06:00

ID

140575

Comment

What's bewildering to me is the white evangelicals who have voted republican and Bush wise for years. How can you claim biblical issue such as abortion and gay rights are the big issues for you but not apparently care or be persuaded by the war in Iraq, unfettered capitalism gone wild and the apparent mileage that republican get out of the use of racism. I don't understand why these later things don't offend them more. If gays or abortionists aren't bothering them personally why the bother or hate of the same. All have sinned and come short including the evangelicals. Unfettered capitalism creates a large and forgotten underclass and you would think a Christian would care deeply about this. The war in Irag has devastated that nation, cause nearly a million lives or so, and has enriched multinational corporations nearly to the extent of grand theft. I don't even need to mention the cost of 400 years of racism, yet these evangelicals still claim to be following the will of God or Jesus. I'm growing scared of them by the second. I'm beginning to feel more comfotable with the klan.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T13:49:47-06:00

ID

140576

Comment

While on the religious tip many of us blacks gotta learn soon to balance the gay and abortion matter with other tenets or rules of the the bible too, or stop crying the blues about situational issues that benefit mostly us. I'm thru ranting and pray God forgives, helps, protects and spares us all, wherever and however he finds us.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T14:00:02-06:00

ID

140577

Comment

"Y'ALL" didn't hear me. These are not just backwards, uneducated people with these beliefs. These are educated people working side by side with me (I saw some of the emails before the election - one guy forgot to take his black co-worker off the list). Granted, I do believe that ultimately some of them will realize they had nothing to fear - we really didn't want them to report to the cotton field. As for Christians, I'm clueless. Didn't Jesus say love everybody, especially your enemies? But then today's good ole southern baptists would have thrown that radical guy out of their church!

Author

lanier77

Date

2008-11-11T14:13:07-06:00

ID

140578

Comment

I am so sorrowful that some people see an Obama Presidency as a reason to fear. I see him as a vastly superior leader to any choice we have had since I can't remember when. The South will change. It already has somewhat. The South is not irrelevant politically; it has just become contested enough to allow the rest of the country to take control. The only way forward for the South is to embrace a diverse country and discredit the politics of fear. It will take time, but surely it must come, or it will stagnate and wither.

Author

gwilly

Date

2008-11-11T14:25:22-06:00

ID

140579

Comment

Jesus said, *Let he who is without sin cast the first stone*. You would think that with the vicious villanizing of those who support a woman's right to choose (my cousin's white husband from Alabama asked her how she could vote for a baby killer) or gay and lesbians right to be how they were probably born that there are a LOT of sinless people. They profess the New Testament, but practice an eye for a tooth.

Author

FreeClif

Date

2008-11-11T14:33:37-06:00

ID

140580

Comment

I do hear you Lanier. I'm not too worried about the poor and uneducated ones except at the polls and when I have a breakdown near their homes. LOL. I'm more worried about those bastards with great power, money, position and influence. Personally, I have't found them to be much different from the others who hate and wish me bad luck. The smart ones are trying to put the screws to me while smiling and convinced I'm too dumb to see it. The smart and powerful racists are the reasons I have so much appreciation for Jessie, Farakan and Al. They will soon see it and will call it out. The smart racists are partially the reason I study and work so hard. We gotta outsmart them.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T14:35:24-06:00

ID

140581

Comment

RE: *not too worried about the poor and uneducated ones except...when I have a breakdown near their homes.* I feel you on that one. I got stuck off the side of the road once in the backwoods and some good ol' boys stopped. I was a little worried until they smiled and asked if I needed help. They pulled me out right fast and were off on their way. Some of them don't hate us, they are just afraid of one of us as president or guv! I do think that after a couple of inaugurals and things are going well and no one has rioted, then some of them will relax a little.

Author

FreeClif

Date

2008-11-11T14:46:02-06:00

ID

140582

Comment

I hope so, Whitley. I broke down near the house of a white couple too, and wound up meeting two of the nicest people I ever met. They invited me into their house, allowed me to use the phone and called a wrecker for me. I wished I had kept their names and addresses and did something really wonderful for them in return. They obviously weren't racist or scared of blacks. Once we started talking they turned out to know lots of my college friends who had moved back home after professional school. This happened on 82 in the Delta where it shouldn't surprise anyone. My good raising, life experiences, and education couple with lots of hope and love just won't let me be unnecessarily hateful or at all raicts. I beleive in part that good things keep happening to me because I practice doing good things for and to others.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T14:56:26-06:00

ID

140583

Comment

I don't understand the New York Times. Barack Obama wins two traditionally conservative states by INCHES over a, let's be honest, a clearly inferior competitor, and all the sudden the South is irrelevant in politics.

Author

bryan doyle

Date

2008-11-11T15:19:33-06:00

ID

140584

Comment

Forecasting, Bryan, based on the tsunami finally coming this way. It came thru the east, west and north earlier. Water runs down hill! Smile. I hope he's right.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-11T15:32:56-06:00

ID

140585

Comment

I had no idea that the south was the center of the political universe until last Tuesday. I think that the Republican's who held office had done such a horrible job the Democrats were gonna win this past election no matter who was the nominee. That being said I am very glad it was Obama. I have said before here and in person to anyone who would listen, including some my apoplectic friends, that he was by far the best person for the job (that was running and had a chance to win). So I don't think that this election cycle is such a harbinger of future trends as the Times is trying to make it out to be. The Republicans left people like me behind, fiscal conservatives with socially liberal beliefs on issues like gay marriage, abortion and just staying out of people's private lives. When they busted the bank and started wars with no exit strategies they proved themselves no friend of fiscally responsible people. So who did that leave to vote for them?

Author

WMartin

Date

2008-11-11T18:16:23-06:00

ID

140587

Comment

I think that the Republicans embraced the South as part of a "strategy" and now the South has them in a death grip and won't let go. In many respects, the South is more trouble politically than it's worth. When the Democrats held it, the party was constantly at risk of pulling itself apart, as Northern urban voters and rural Southern voters disagreed on social issues in general and race in particular. When LBJ gave up the South, it left an opportunity for that supremely cynical opportunist Nixon to seize the prize. It was quite telling that when Bush won in 2004, 70 percent of his electoral votes were Southern. The problem is that the South does not play well with others, in the sense that it tends to be extremely conservative and uncompromising on social issues. (I guess that's one way of glossing the Civil War.) Now, the Republicans have a problem similar to the one Democrats had 50 years ago. In fairness, it's not just the South. It's evangelical, rural, white voters. Those voters can carry states in the Midwest too, but they are most concentrated in the South. When someone as deeply conservative as John McCain is insufficiently conservative for the base, the party is in deep trouble. He was unable to appeal to independents because he had to shift very hard to the right to win the primaries. He selected a vice president (from the northern North, FWIW) who was so conservative she wouldn't even share a stage with pro-choice Republicans, according to news reports. Now, 65 percent of Republicans want Palin to run in 2012? That's what I call a second term for Obama. Wedding your party to rural, white, evangelical voters is embracing a shrinking demographic. Meanwhile, people like Bush and McCain could not woo Latinos because rural, white, evangelical voters had to babble on about "anchor babies" and "illegals" for the last three years. Obama slaughtered the Republicans among Latinos, even though many of them are socially conservative. Just like many black voters are, by the way. It's hard to see how the Republicans can fix this problem.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2008-11-11T19:30:16-06:00

ID

140589

Comment

I agree, Brian. The untold story of this election, IMHO, is that Republican racism destroyed their parity among Latinos. Bush won 44% of the Latino vote in 2004, but McCain only carried 31% last week--and he was co-author of one of the more popular comprehensive immigration proposals out there, running ads in Spanish, hailing from Arizona, etc. If the next Republican nominee does even that well among Latinos, I will be very surprised--especially if Obama successfully gets comprehensive immigration reform passed during his first term. And as commentators noted before the election, it's really really hard to see a scenario where a Republican can win the presidency, regardless of what else happens, if s/he doesn't pull at least 35% of the Latino vote. The Republican Party lost the black vote, and now it looks like the Latino vote is heading in the same direction. The party has always trailed among women. And among people under 30. So the question becomes: What does the Republican Party have left? White men. The straight ones. If they're not college graduates. And if they're of a certain age. The Republican Party will dominate Mississippi statewide politics for a little while longer I think (more because the Mississippi Democratic Party is still clinging too much to the failed Dixiecrat model than because of its own merits), but it's rapidly turning into a regional party and will go the way of the Federalists in 20 years if there isn't a major national rebranding effort and a serious attempt to diversify. Bush to his credit tried to rebrand in 2000 with the "compassionate conservative" label, and in 2004 9/11 was too recent a memory to make such questions relevant, but in the long view I don't see a way out for the Republican Party unless it repents of what it was and tries to become something different, much as the Democratic Party did beginning with the addition of the civil rights plank in 1948 and culminating in the Nixon realignment of the late 60s/early 70s.

Author

Tom Head

Date

2008-11-11T20:21:05-06:00

ID

140590

Comment

I do think, however, that this map demands some consideration. This was after LBJ signed the Civil Rights Act, and it was after Nixon successfully deployed the Southern strategy. Just as incredible to our eyes now is that Ford took states such as New Jersey and Illinois. That's what the Republican Party has jettisoned by destroying its moderate wing. Obviously, Carter would have had a harder time taking all those Southern states had he not been from Georgia, but I think what Obama's victory in states like North Carolina and Virginia shows is that relatively small shifts can turn Southern states blue. This is the other prism through which we can look at the Democratic Party's former dominance in the South: its economic populism. It wasn't all race. That's why FDR still resonates in Southern states, as the NYT article noted. That said, the persistence of that Southern thing, the social conservatism that deserves a label befitting its ugliness, is discouraging. The politics of hate has its moment in states such as California, Florida, Kansas, and New Jersey. But it seems so entrenched in the South. And yet, I know of so many social conservatives in the South who voted for Obama this year after voting for Bush in the last two elections. Many of them won't admit it to their friends and family members. They are secretly horrified at the venom they've heard from people who assume they're on the same side. And Obama greatly improved the Democratic share of young evangelicals, who are alienated by the "agents of intolerance" even as they continue to believe that abortion is a mortal sin. I do think that Democrats should go after Southern states full tilt. They just shouldn't compromise their values to do it.

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2008-11-11T21:00:09-06:00

ID

140593

Comment

Great commentary fellows. Come back home Brian. We need you.

Author

Walt

Date

2008-11-12T09:19:27-06:00

ID

140620

Comment

Walt, I would take that more seriously if it didn't come from a known ladybug voyeur. ;)

Author

Brian C Johnson

Date

2008-11-12T18:48:51-06:00